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The Bible and Homosexuality
August 4, 2012
9:55 pm
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humphreys
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"greeney2" wrote: So nobody but you decides what response should be given, to your engineered question?

The response given should be on the subject of the thread. Yours wasn't.

"greeney2" wrote: You try making an premise by pitting several things in the Bible against each other for some far fetched analogy, and expect everyone should see it the way you are twisting. But in actual practice in our society, these things are not clouded in our laws.

I simply mentioned a passage from Leviticus which Christians often use to condemn homosexuality, and then compared that to some other passages from Leviticus which Christians tended to ignore, and then asked why there was an apparent double-standard.

Frrosted got it, and he gave his response. That's fine, nice one frrosted. As a serious Christian, he knows his Bible and has read it, you were unable to answer because you know sod-all about your own religion and have not even read the Bible, but can't help go off on a rant about who-knows-what anyway.

"All of our behavior can be traced to biological events about which we have no conscious knowledge: this has always suggested that free will is an illusion."

- Sam Harris

August 4, 2012
10:00 pm
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humphreys
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"frrostedman" wrote: The simple answer is, homosexuality is condemned in the New Testament.

What are your thoughts on this article that claims otherwise?

"Mainline Christian denominations in this country are bitterly divided over the question of homosexuality. For this reason it is important to ask what light, if any, the New Testament sheds on this controversial issue. Most people apparently assume that the New Testament expresses strong opposition to homosexuality, but this simply is not the case. The six propositions that follow, considered cumulatively, lead to the conclusion that the New Testament does not provide any direct guidance for understanding and making judgments about homosexuality in the modern world."

http://www.westarinstitute.org/Periodic ... ality.html

"All of our behavior can be traced to biological events about which we have no conscious knowledge: this has always suggested that free will is an illusion."

- Sam Harris

August 4, 2012
10:20 pm
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DIss0n80r
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Also, slightly off-topic, but I'd like to point out that the Ten Commandments as a whole is not a valid legal document. Much of it is plainly unconstitutional.

http://atheism.about.com/od/tencommandm ... nlaw_2.htm

Of the ten Commandments, only three have any parallels in American law

Finally, it must be kept in mind that constitutional protections of religious liberty are written in a manner that are practically designed to break several Commandments. Thus, far from reflecting the Ten Commandments, it is arguable that the principles of American law are set up to break several of them and ignore most of the rest.

"I can conceive of nothing in religion, science, or philosophy, that is anything more than the proper thing to wear, for a while." ~ Charles Fort

August 4, 2012
10:28 pm
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greeney2
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"DIss0n80r" wrote: He seems to want to know why so many Christians get worked up over that one part (homosexuality) and emphasize it so much, yet usually ignore those other parts and basically shrug it off when asked about them.

Kinda like you're doing.

It's a fair question.

By the way, we don't have a christian government.

Yes we in fact do have a Christian/Judeo government becasue we are predominatly people that have a Faith in most cases, however they do not pass laws based souly on their religous teaching, or passages out of the Bible IMHO. We are a nation under God, and it is shown in most all of our levels of Government, with symbols and many standards. Unlike the Clerics and those leading Muslim countries, they do in fact pass laws and enforce laws based on the things that are 1000's of years old. In other words our elected people, who are religious believers, historically separate religious beliefs from the making of our laws. This separates a Christian/Judeo philosophy of the free world, from oppressive dictatorships of 3rd world nations, many under Muslim, Buddist, Hindu, or Atheistic rule.

August 4, 2012
10:33 pm
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greeney2
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"DIss0n80r" wrote: Also, slightly off-topic, but I'd like to point out that the Ten Commandments as a whole is not a valid legal document. Much of it is plainly unconstitutional.

http://atheism.about.com/od/tencommandm ... nlaw_2.htm

Of the ten Commandments, only three have any parallels in American law

Finally, it must be kept in mind that constitutional protections of religious liberty are written in a manner that are practically designed to break several Commandments. Thus, far from reflecting the Ten Commandments, it is arguable that the principles of American law are set up to break several of them and ignore most of the rest.

Stop derailing Humphreys thread for crying out loud! Laugh

Several years ago I wrote thread, that talked about "right and wrong", "our laws", and "what is or is not Sin". There is a big conflict something between the three, and other times total agreement of the three. Forinstance Murder is all 3, where others may only be one or the other, or possibly 2 or the 3.

August 4, 2012
10:57 pm
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DIss0n80r
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We don't live under a democratic theocracy, Greene. We are a secular representative republic. Certain American laws parallel religious dogma insofar as they overlap as common sense rules of civilization pre-dating christianity.

There is a distinction between having any specific religion serve as the basis for our law and government, and simply having dovetailing principles and interests when codifying civil and religious liberties.

At this point, I would like for you to make it clear to us if you think every Commandment should be recognized as American law and enforced, so that the breaking of any Commandment will be punishable by law.

Don't avoid the question and cherry-pick the parts that happen to reflect American law. Answer the actual question with a yes or no and then explain why you agree/disagree that the Ten Commandments in its entirety should be instituted and enforced by law.

"I can conceive of nothing in religion, science, or philosophy, that is anything more than the proper thing to wear, for a while." ~ Charles Fort

August 4, 2012
11:03 pm
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DIss0n80r
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"greeney2" wrote: Stop derailing Humphreys thread for crying out loud! Laugh

My post was simply a correction of your own off-topic post. It could no more derail the topic than the post I was correcting. Should I take this as an admission that you were indeed derailing his thread?

"I can conceive of nothing in religion, science, or philosophy, that is anything more than the proper thing to wear, for a while." ~ Charles Fort

August 5, 2012
12:49 am
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khanster
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The facts:

Gays appear to be extremely promiscuous and adulterous...

http://www.cdc.gov/nchhstp/newsroom/doc ... 08COMP.pdf

Gay and bisexual men — referred to in CDC surveillance systems as men who have sex with men (MSM)1 — of all races continue to be the risk group most severely affected by HIV. CDC’s most recent data show that between 2006 and 2009, the number of new infections that occur each year increased among young MSM — driven by an alarming 48 percent increase among young, black MSM 13 to 29 years old. These data clearly show the urgent need to expand access to proven HIV prevention programs for gay and bisexual men, and to develop new approaches to fight HIV in this population.

In Matthew 15: 19-20 (KJV) Jesus says:

“For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

In Mark 7: 20-23 (KJV) it says:

“ And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man. For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, sexual impurities, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.

August 5, 2012
1:11 am
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DIss0n80r
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"I can conceive of nothing in religion, science, or philosophy, that is anything more than the proper thing to wear, for a while." ~ Charles Fort

August 5, 2012
2:34 am
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khanster
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http://www.myjewishlearning.com/life/Se ... khah.shtml

An important point to make from the outset is that Jewish law does not teach that it is forbidden to be a homosexual. On the contrary, Jewish law is concerned not with the source of a person’s erotic urges nor with inner feelings, but with acts. The Torah forbids the homosexual act, known as mishkav zakhar, but has nothing to say about homosexuality as a state of being or a personal inclination.

In other words, traditionally, a person with a homosexual inclination can be an entirely observant Jew as long as he or she does not act out that inclination.

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