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# Religion & Spirituality

## William Lane Craig

Whether you believe in a higher power or not, this forum is dedicated to the topic of religion and spirituality. We live in a diverse world with different morals and ideas when it comes to our beliefs, so come in and share your thoughts.

## Re: William Lane Craig

at1with0 wrote:Between two points there are infinitely many points in between and that is what I think is causing Frosty to assert that the distance between two points is infinite.

If two points are in exactly the same position, they should not be considered two separate points, do you agree?

In which case, there must be a finite non-zero distance between every two points, yes?

Any non-zero number multiplied by infinity must equal infinity?

In which case, if there are an infinite number of points, the total distance must also be infinite. The total distance cannot actually be infinite, therefore there cannot be an infinite number of points, as far as I can see. Again, we have to accept the minimum size plank length to get around such paradoxes.
"All of our behavior can be traced to biological events about which we have no conscious knowledge: this has always suggested that free will is an illusion."

- Sam Harris

humphreys

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Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:51 pm

## Re: William Lane Craig

What ever the measurement is, is the number of points are the expressed increments. The count of those increments are the number of points and the size of each increment is defined as the scale, and limits of the measuring instrument. Inches, feet, miles, light years.
greeney2

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Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 11:54 am

## Re: William Lane Craig

humphreys wrote:At1, out of interest, do you have an actual degree in mathematics or are you just an amateur fan, so to speak?

Not meaning to detract from your argument if you don't have one, I'm just interested if you have credentials.

I do have a degree in math and I consider myself to be an amateur fan.

humphreys wrote:
at1with0 wrote:Between two points there are infinitely many points in between and that is what I think is causing Frosty to assert that the distance between two points is infinite.

If two points are in exactly the same position, they should not be considered two separate points, do you agree?

Yes.

In which case, there must be a finite non-zero distance between every two points, yes?

If we're talking about points in a Euclidean space such as a line, plane, or 3d space, then between any two points there is a finite non-zero distance. In the "pathological" case when the 2nd point is the 1st point, there no longer are two points and the distance between a point and itself is zero.

What's weird is that in such a context, there are infinitely many points on the line segment connecting two points.
Any non-zero number multiplied by infinity must equal infinity?

It depends on how small that non-zero number is and how big that infinity is. For example, if the non-zero number is an infinitesimal and the infinity is, say, the reciprocal of that infinitesimal, then the product of the two is an appreciable, finite number. However, in many situations, depending on the two inputs, a non-zero number multiplied by infinity is infinity.

In which case, if there are an infinite number of points, the total distance must also be infinite. The total distance cannot actually be infinite, therefore there cannot be an infinite number of points, as far as I can see. Again, we have to accept the minimum size plank length to get around such paradoxes.

The length of a point is zero so we have zero times infinity which is "indeterminate," meaning that it is not a specific appreciable number.
"it is easy to grow crazy"

at1with0

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Location: the coproduct of the amalgam of all structures

## Re: William Lane Craig

My son in law has a Masters in Mathematics and teaches high school math, his Father also teaches Calculus in one of the gifted kids schools in LA high school, has several Masters, one in Mathematics. Both of them are just natural teachers--yes orangetom public school, they definatly are not where your public school opinions come from.
greeney2

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Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 11:54 am

## Re: William Lane Craig

"it is easy to grow crazy"

at1with0

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Location: the coproduct of the amalgam of all structures

## Re: William Lane Craig

I'm sure they know who he was, probably every LA city school system teacher does. My son in law would be too young to have worked with him If my son in laws Father crossed paths as coworkers, it would have been early in his 35 years, and Escalante retired in 1991 according to the bio. Its a school system as big as San Francisco, Oakland, and San Jose combined I'm sure.
greeney2

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Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 11:54 am

## Re: William Lane Craig

at1with0 wrote:It depends on how small that non-zero number is and how big that infinity is. For example, if the non-zero number is an infinitesimal and the infinity is, say, the reciprocal of that infinitesimal, then the product of the two is an appreciable, finite number. However, in many situations, depending on the two inputs, a non-zero number multiplied by infinity is infinity.

Ok, that makes sense.

at1with0 wrote:The length of a point is zero so we have zero times infinity which is "indeterminate," meaning that it is not a specific appreciable number.

Gotcha.
"All of our behavior can be traced to biological events about which we have no conscious knowledge: this has always suggested that free will is an illusion."

- Sam Harris

humphreys

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Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:51 pm

## Re: William Lane Craig

khanster

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## Re: William Lane Craig

Nice tie.
"it is easy to grow crazy"

at1with0

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Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 5:55 pm
Location: the coproduct of the amalgam of all structures

## Re: William Lane Craig

humphreys wrote:Either that or mathematics itself is insufficient to deal with the issue perfectly. The distance between two points cannot actually be infinite, even if mathematics might suggest it is, otherwise motion would be impossible.

how so?
Every one who is seriously involved in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the Universe-a spirit vastly superior to that of man. - Albert Einstein

frrostedman

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