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What are the limits of humans in deep space travel?

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Postby greeney2 » Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:15 am

The weakest link in any chain is always the limit. What ever equipment is invented to get us to Mars and back, the weakest link in deep space travel, is the human mind. How long can a man endure this kind of long journey and keep him/herself mentally in tact? Confined space, no way to return, you are trapped, and have no control. What kind of special mind does it take, and how do we know that we have it? Even these people in the simulator could crack up just remembering how long the simulator was. Not to mention at anytime, they could say, "get me out of the simulator, I can't do anymore". What happens if one or more astronauts cracks up, or 2 develope personality conflicts? When does a problem become serious enough to be considered life threatening. Reminds you of the flim "The shinning", where Jack Nickelson slowly goes nuts from isolation. Maybe its no more than what submarine crews endure, but even a long sub mission has a light at the end of the trunnel, and they may rotate people having chances to get out and onto the tower. Mars is a mission that will require nearly 2 years, how will we ever consider missions that may result in such long durations, they you may never return? What does a crew do if one member just totally breaks down half way to Mars? Is deep space travel simply not in human capacity of confinment, and control of the human mind? We only use a small portion of our brain as it is, does man need to develope his brain capacity far more, to endure such tests of the mind?

6 men endure Mars flight simulation experiment
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Delicious Digg Facebook Fark Newsvine Reddit StumbleUpon Technorati Yahoo! Bookmarks Print AP – The team of researchers, from left, Russian Sergei Ryazansky, Aleksei Baranov, German Oliver Knickel, … By MANSUR MIROVALEV, Associated Press Writer Mansur Mirovalev, Associated Press Writer – Wed Jul 15, 4:58 am ET
MOSCOW – Russian engineers broke a red wax seal and six men emerged from a metal hatch after 105 days of isolation in a mock spacecraft, still smiling after testing the stresses that space travelers may face on the journey to Mars.

Sergei Ryazansky, the captain of the six-man crew, told reporters at a Moscow research institute near the Kremlin on Tuesday that the most difficult thing was knowing that instead of making the 172-million mile (276-million kilometer) journey they were locked in a windowless module of metal canisters the size of railway cars.

The men, chosen from 6,000 applicants, were paid euro15,000 ($20,987) each to be sealed up in the mock space capsule since March 31_ cut off almost entirely from the outside world.

They had no television or Internet and their only link to the outside world was communications with the experiment's controllers — who also monitored them via TV cameras — and an internal e-mail system. Communications with the outside world had 20-minute delays to imitate a real space flight.

Each crew member had his personal cabin. The interiors had hatches similar to a submarine's and were paneled in faux wood according to Soviet style of the 1970s, when the structure was originally built for space-related experiments.

The module's entrance was locked with a padlock and red sealing wax and twine — the kind that Soviet government bureaucrats have used for years to close up their offices at the end of the work day.

Common facilities included a gym and a small garden, and the modules were equipped with the new European and Russian exercise and training equipment for biomedical research. The crew also specially prepared meals and used toilets closely resembling those on the space station.

Some veteran space explorers belittled the value of the experiment, but its backers at the Russian and European space agencies insist it will only move humans closer to a real mission.

"What we're doing is important for future missions exploring the solar system," said Simonetta Di Pipo, director of the human space flight program at the European Space Agency.

"The most difficult part was that the flight was not for real," Ryazansky, wearing a blue, NASA-style jumpsuit with a large patch reading "MARS 500," told reporters hours after he and the crew emerged from the modules.

Crew member Alexey Baranov complained that the worst thing was not being with his relatives: "The separation from my loved ones and nature was depressing."

Russian TV showed images of the men — four Russians, a German and a Frenchman — during their stay, conducting experiments, lifting weights or lounging in leather reclining chairs, surrounded by throw pillows and Oriental rugs.

The men said most of them gained weight during their stay, exercising much of the time, and running experiments for medical researchers.

Psychologist Olga Shevchenko said they avoided conflicts thanks to a busy schedule and intense physical training. However, she said they all complained being deprived of sights of the natural world and separation from their families.

While officials at the Institute for Medical and Biological Problems praised the experiment as a success and promised to conduct a 500-day simulation experiment later this year, some veterans of the Soviet or Russian space programs doubted its value.

"This is nothing but a test for a long isolation of average people," a two-time cosmonaut Valentin Lebedev wrote in an opinion column published in the Sovietskaya Rossiya newspaper daily last month. "Such an experiment has only vague relation to understanding the possibility of interplanetary flight."

The experiment was the second for the institute, whose previous effort in 1999 ended in scandal when a Canadian woman complained of being forcibly kissed by a Russian captain and said that two Russian crew members had a fist fight that left blood splattered on the walls.

Russian officials at the time downplayed the incidents, attributing it to cultural gaps and stress.

Soviet engineers also tried a similar yearlong experiment, but that was interrupted because of unending conflicts between crew members.
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Postby greeney2 » Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:22 am

Something that has probably been regarded as top secret, is the documented times Astronaunts have had any kind of breakdowns in space. There must be a well documented by very secret evaluation system of the hundreds of astronauts and cosmonauts, where they know certain indicators of behaviors, shown as missions result in certain things. Quirks that start showing up on a 3rd or 4th mission, shortness of temper or other indicators of stress. How many squabbles have occuerred in the close quarters of the space station, and over long periods of being there? When do they know its time to get this guy back on the ground? Quick!
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Postby evutch » Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:10 pm

things learned..

don't take ANY russians..
take at least TWO women..
lots of low calorie snacks..
and a 3-D viewer of natural parks..

oh yeah..
and possibly a padded room...lockable from the outside, ( and inside)..
:twisted:
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Postby greeney2 » Thu Jul 16, 2009 8:56 am

It isn't big enough for a spare room!
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Postby mael » Fri Jul 17, 2009 3:42 am

I'm quite sure I could manage a few months in a spacecraft on my way to Mars.

But I'd need at least two of my women and preferably three of them.

I have a few experiments in zero gravity I'd like to try which require females and I'd need to be able to test and re-test the results many times.
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Postby chiselray » Mon Jul 20, 2009 7:57 pm

deep space travel is not possible without dieing along the way..
There is too much radiation, gamma out there to survive for an exploration journey..
Its just a waste of time ,we live here and here we shall die..
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Postby chiselray » Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:06 pm

oh and just for mael,have sex here too..
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Postby Tairaa » Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:46 pm

The limit is the limit of human ingenuity as far as I can tell. Radiation is no problem if we have technology that makes it a non-issue. Human conditioning can only go so far naturally however. Perhaps a controlled coma state, or cryogenic hibernation? Take for instance the following: Google:geomagnetism human mood
When we first went into space we obviously didn't know about geomagnetism, but now we do, and now we have devices that create artificial fields to imitate the ones we have naturally here on earth in order to remain sane.


We'll figure it out, I guarantee it, it's just a matter of how long it will take. I bet you by the end of my life (save for any unfortunate early ends) we'll in the very least have an installation on the moon and Mars. Terraforming might take a really long time, so we might not have a full blown colony on Mars in my life, but I don't think it's unlikely. With any luck some sweet events will occur soon and productivity increases, sciences jumps in leaps and bounds, the economy gets really strong allowing for technology to be used commercially and industrially much more, and newer stuff, and newer stuff will get developed, then we'll have our first unsuccessful attempts and the crews are going to end up taking causalities and there are going to be accidents etc..

But we'll eventually get it no matter what, the only thing that could possibly stop us is if we are killed off.
"George Bush says he speaks to god every day, and christians love him for it. If George Bush said he spoke to god through his hair dryer, they would think he was mad. I fail to see how the addition of a hair dryer makes it any more absurd."
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Postby chiselray » Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:52 pm

Ive tried ebay and everywhere for a gamma suit..looks hard to get
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Postby Tairaa » Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:03 pm

Hahaha! Yes indeed, that's because it takes in the ballpark of a foot of lead to stop gamma rays reliably. Or several feet of concrete. :P
This isn't feasible for personal use obviously, but who's to say that technology won't be developed later on that works? And even failing that, we can outfit out spacecraft with a couple feet of a radioactively absorbent material. Boron enriched paint also! Boron apparently absorbs radiation quite well.
"George Bush says he speaks to god every day, and christians love him for it. If George Bush said he spoke to god through his hair dryer, they would think he was mad. I fail to see how the addition of a hair dryer makes it any more absurd."
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