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Postby zoltan2 » Sat Oct 22, 2011 8:47 am

shadowcass wrote:Just one point..."Elohim" is the plural of the Hebrew "El" and means "Most High" it is the name translated "God" in Genesis. The Old Testament (Hebrew Bible) is FULL of alternative names for God because the True Name is considered too sacred to be spoken. That is the famous "Tetragrammaton" or 4-lettered name that God applies to Himself when asked by Moses "Who shall I say has sent me?" It is usually anglicized as "Yahweh" or "Jehovah" and means "I am He Who Is" alternatively it could be translated as "I am the First Cause". But see my blog on this https://thenookofwisdom.wordpress.com/2 ... -the-nook/

I don't really mind if people want to come up with wack theories about the Bible and UFOs based on their complete ignorance of the languages involved but for those who might be confused let us be clear.

There IS mention of things that resemble the Modern Conception of UFOs but it has no connection with "Elohim".
But see https://thenookofwisdom.wordpress.com/2 ... us-truths/ for a brief introduction to this.

Additionally one might take notice of "Elijah" who is referenced in that blog. His name incorporates both EL and "Jah" and, in addition he is called "the Tishbite." Now, "Tishbite" is from the Hebrew word for "Stranger".

There is a whole community of these "Strangers" living in the area of Gilead. Their community is called "Tishbe". So Elijah is a Stranger from among the Strangers in Gilead. Traditional scholars take it that he was born there but there is no indication of that.

ALL we DO know is that he was not a member of any tribe or race known to the Israelities of that day...and that is really ODD when you think about it.

Not only have the Israelites wandered all over the place during the Exodus but the great days of the Kingdom of David and his son Solomon have come and gone.

So just who in the hell ARE these "Strangers" and how is it that the only one we know by name leaves in a UFO?

THAT is what people should be looking into...not empty theories about alien races called "Elohim" or whatever that have only come about because the writers who popularized these conspiracy theories knew little Hebrew and less Greek.

Incidentally "Elohim" (Greek "Eloi") is the Name Jesus calls on from the cross.

Now you may carry on....


Jesus did not cry out the name Eloi or Elijah

"And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, "Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?" that is, "My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?" Some of those who stood there, when they heard that, said, "This Man is calling for Elijah!" Immediately one of them ran and took a sponge, filled it with sour wine and put it on a reed, and offered it to Him to drink. The rest said, "Let Him alone; let us see if Elijah will come to save Him."" (Matthew 27:46-49).

"And at the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?" which is translated, "My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?" Some of those who stood by, when they heard that, said, "Look, He is calling for Elijah!" Then someone ran and filled a sponge full of sour wine, put it on a reed, and offered it to Him to drink, saying, "Let Him alone; let us see if Elijah will come to take Him down."" (Mark 15:34-36)

The crowd was not fully convinced that Jesus wasn't the Messiah. They retained an element of doubt. They knew from their teachers that Elijah was supposed to arrive first. Hence, they were of a mind set to wonder if perhaps Jesus would call upon Elijah to rescue him.

Therefore, with a crowd expecting a possibility of Elijah coming and hearing Jesus utter words that are somewhat similar to the name Elijah ("eli" with the final punctual sound missing), it is not an amazing thing to learn that they had jumped to the wrong conclusion. The inspired writers and witnesses to the events told us that it was the crowd who mistook what Jesus said. These same men told us with the accuracy given to them by God what Jesus said and the correct translation of what Jesus said from Aramaic into Greek.


The literal definition of "Eli Eli Lama sabachthani," the words Jesus used while he was on the cross and the meaning of these words in the Greek.

The scripture in question is in Matthew 27:

"Now from the sixth hour until the ninth hour there was darkness over all the land. And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, 'Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?' that is, 'My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?' " (Matthew 27:45-46, NKJV throughout)

The Greek text from which Jesus' statement is derived is:

English translation: Eli, Eli
Greek: ηλί, ηλί
Literal meaning: God, God


English translation: lama
Greek: λαμά, λαμμα
Literal meaning: Why

English translation: sabachthani
Greek: σαβαχθανι
Literal meaning: You have left (forsaken, abandoned) me
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Postby zoltan2 » Sat Oct 22, 2011 9:24 am

shadowcass wrote:Oh...one more thing...the English word "Demon" is a cognate of the Greek "Daimon" which meant "Wise One" and was used by Socrates as the name of the being that was instructing him. In the New Testament it is the name given to the creatures Jesus and His disciples encounter in various places. (Usually mistranslated as "devils" in the King James version among other places.)

What these are are the surviving spirits of the Nephilim who lost their physical bodies when the Flood wiped out all life. They were the offspring of human women and the Fallen Ones.

You can find the account of the birth of these half-breeds in the sixth chapter of Genesis. They are still around and still looking for bodies to possess...in one case "the demoniac of the Gadarenes" they even ask permission to go into pigs rather than remain bodiless. Unfortunately it turned out that the pigs would rather commit mass suicide than live with these things in them ;) cf The Gospel According to Luke 8th Chapter 26th through the 37th verse.

This is the incident where the creatures possessing the man give their name as LEGION ("for we are many") remember the movie GHOST RIDER?

You might also be interested in this link: http://www.prairieghosts.com/werewolves.html where you will read: "One of the first Wisconsin werewolf sightings occurred in 1936. A man named Mark Schackelman reportedly encountering a talking wolfman just east of Jefferson, Wisconsin on Highway 18. As he was driving along the road one evening, he spotted a figure digging in an old Indian mound. He looked closer and saw that the figure was a strange, hair-covered creature that stood erect and stood more than six feet tall. The face of the creature boasted a muzzle and features of both an ape and a dog. Its hands were oddly formed with a twisted thumb and three fully formed fingers. The beast gave off a putrid smell that was like “decaying meat”.

Schackelman returned to the site the following evening, hoping for another look, and this time, he actually heard the creature speak in what he described as being “neo human”. The beats uttered a “three-syllable growling noise that sounded like gadara with the emphasis on the second syllable.” Schackelman was a religious man and after spotting this obviously “evil” creature, he began to back away from it and to pray. Eventually the creature was lost to sight." follow the link for more.



Further information: Agathodaemon, Cacodemon, Daimonic, and Eudaimonia
Buer, the 10th spirit, who teaches "Moral and Natural Philosophy" (from a 1995 Mathers edition. Illustration by Louis Breton from Dictionnaire Infernal).

Ancient Greek δαίμων daimōn is a word for "spirit" or "divine power", much like the Latin genius or numen.

The Greek term does not have any connotations of evil or malevolence. In fact, εὐδαιμονία, literally "good-spiritedness", is a term for "happiness".

The term first acquired its now-current evil connotations in the Septuagint translation of the Hebrew Bible, informed by the mythology of the ancient Semitic religions.

This connotation was inherited by the Koine text of the New Testament. The medieval and neo-medieval conception of a "demon" in Western civilization (see the Medieval grimoire called the Ars Goetia) derives seamlessly from the ambient popular culture of Late (Roman) Antiquity.

Greco-Roman concepts of daemons that passed into Christian culture are discussed in the entry daemon, though it should be duly noted that the term referred only to a spiritual force, not a malevolent supernatural being. The Hellenistic "daemon" eventually came to include many Semitic and Near Eastern gods as evaluated by Christianity.
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Postby shadowcass » Sat Oct 22, 2011 9:49 am

I did not say Jesus called out Elijah...I said he called out "Eloi" which is a cognate of the Hebrew "El" "Elohim" which does NOT mean "God."

It means "Most High" as I said previously. "God" is NOT a name...it is a title at best, A job description even :)

The word "God" comes from the Indo-European and means (literally) "that which is invoked."

The true name of the being Moses encounters at the Burning Bush is given in Exodus as I referenced previously and the accurate pronounciation of that name has been lost (since written Hebrew had no vowels and the Name was NEVER spoken. Other names or words being substituted in its place "El Shaddai" "Adonai" and so on.

Yod He Vau He "YHVH" the Tetragrammaton...IS the Name "God" gives Moses at the Burning Bush and it means what I said. Now..no vowels (in Hebrew, that is) and as for Yod it can represent the English letters "I" "Y" or "J" , "Vau" (sometimes written "wau" can represent the English letter "V" OR "W" are you beginning to see the problem?

I am getting very sick of people who have never studied Hebrew or Greek or Aramaic OR scripture writing about it.

The Gospel Writers did NOT say people misunderstood the WORDS Jesus uttered from the cross...but some misunderstood the meaning of "El" or "Eloi" as it is rendered in English according to the whims of the translators.
It meant "Most High"

The correct pronounciation in Aramaic, by the way, is " AaLaH" and it is related to the Arabic "Allah" (which means roughly the same).
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Postby shadowcass » Sat Oct 22, 2011 9:58 am

As for "Demon" "Daemon" Socrates used it as I said and it meant "Wise One" or "Dispenser of Wisdom". Instead of spending time consulting dictionaries try reading Plato's Apology.

The writers of the New Testament appropriated the word and the meaning given by them is what I said it is. The bodiless (and malevolent) spirits of the half-breed offspring of Human women and the Fallen "Angels" or as the Book of Enoch calls them "Watchers."

The Christian writers (or God) appropriate words many times and give them special meaning. For instance, Paul will take the word "Pistis" meaning "Faith" and give it a special meaning..."Faith IN Christ" any OTHER faith, for him and for faithing Christians he calls "apistis" Faith in the wrong thing. This is the root of the word "apostasy" by the way, Faith going the wrong direction.

The mistake so many writers who try to interpret words from these books of the Old and New Testament is that they miss the CONTEXT in which the words are being used BY THESE WRITERS and instead try to apply the definitions the word had when used by other writers.
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Postby shadowcass » Sat Oct 22, 2011 10:25 am

One more thing:

It is a common misconception that the New Testament was orignally written in Aramaic. SOME of it was...but Luke was born in Greece and was a highly educated man who had trained as a physician before he became a Roman slave. He wrote his gospel and the later "Acts of the Apostles" in GREEK.

Paul was a half-brother to Rufus Pudens Pudentianna (they had the same mother) Rufus Pudens Pudentianna served as an officer with the Roman Army in Britain and married a British woman Claudia Rufina and was named as a servant of the Emperar Claudius among the sepulchral chambers of the Imperial household. According to the Latin inscription on a stone discovered at Chichester, Pudens, son of Pudentinus, gave a site there for a Temple to Neptune and Minerva. The inscription also bears the name of the Emperor Tiberius Claudius, who died in AD 37, so we can be concluded that Rufus Pudens had not yet converted to Christianity until at least sometime after AD 37.

Rufus Pudens Pudentianna became the owner of Palatium Britannicum after his marriage to Caratacus's daughter (and the Roman Emperor Claudius' ADOPTED daughter) Claudia. The Palatium Britannicum (Palace of the Britons) was the main Christian Stronghold in Rome and is the household Paul sends his Epistle to the Romans TO "Salute Rufus chosen in the Lord, and his mother and mine." (Romans 16:13).

Paul was equally conversant in Latin, Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic and had studied Plato's Dialogues heavily in his youth (which fitted him for his role as Apostle to the Gentiles which the RISEN CHRIST selected him for).

Now, it doesn't matter whether you believe Jesus rose from the dead or not. I am not out to convert anyone. What I want people to see is that not all the early Christian figures were ignorant fishermen.
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Postby zoltan2 » Sat Oct 22, 2011 10:40 am

shadowcass wrote:One more thing:

It is a common misconception that the New Testament was orignally written in Aramaic. SOME of it was...but Luke was born in Greece and was a highly educated man who had trained as a physician before he became a Roman slave. He wrote his gospel and the later "Acts of the Apostles" in GREEK.

Paul was a half-brother to Rufus Pudens Pudentianna (they had the same mother) Rufus Pudens Pudentianna served as an officer with the Roman Army in Britain and married a British woman Claudia Rufina and was named as a servant of the Emperar Claudius among the sepulchral chambers of the Imperial household. According to the Latin inscription on a stone discovered at Chichester, Pudens, son of Pudentinus, gave a site there for a Temple to Neptune and Minerva. The inscription also bears the name of the Emperor Tiberius Claudius, who died in AD 37, so we can be concluded that Rufus Pudens had not yet converted to Christianity until at least sometime after AD 37.

Rufus Pudens Pudentianna became the owner of Palatium Britannicum after his marriage to Caratacus's daughter (and the Roman Emperor Claudius' ADOPTED daughter) Claudia. The Palatium Britannicum (Palace of the Britons) was the main Christian Stronghold in Rome and is the household Paul sends his Epistle to the Romans TO "Salute Rufus chosen in the Lord, and his mother and mine." (Romans 16:13).

Paul was equally conversant in Latin, Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic and had studied Plato's Dialogues heavily in his youth (which fitted him for his role as Apostle to the Gentiles which the RISEN CHRIST selected him for).

Now, it doesn't matter whether you believe Jesus rose from the dead or not. I am not out to convert anyone. What I want people to see is that not all the early Christian figures were ignorant fishermen.


Paul is the founder of Christianity and deified Jesus

Christianity is a combination of Hellenistic Greek religious motifs with Jewish concepts. Paul is the real founder of Christianity.

But Paul is regarded as the great interpreter of Jesus' mission, who explained, in a way that Jesus himself never did, how Jesus' life and death fitted into a cosmic scheme of salvation, stretching from the creation of Adam to the end of time.

Jesus never knew Paul and they never once met.

The disciples who knew Jesus best, such as Peter, James and John, have left no writings behind them explaining how Jesus seemed to them or what they considered his mission to have been.
Do not forget that the Gospels and all of Paul's writings did not existed during Jesus time on earth.

Paul never met Jesus during his lifetime although once he saw a bright light that blinded him and voice saying Why do you persecute me.

We know about Paul from his own letters and the book of Acts, which gives a full account of Paul life. In fact, he is the hero of Acts, which was written by an admirer and follower named Luke who was also the author of the Gospel of that name.
Luke like Paul were not an immediate apostles of Jesus and they never met Jesus

Those who were immediate close to Jesus regarded with great suspicion and dismay the Christological theories of Paul, flaunting his brand new visions in interpretation of the Jesus whom he had never met in the flesh.

What would Jesus think of Paul

Paul's doctrine of Jesus is a daring departure from Judaism.

Paul was advocating a doctrine that seemed more in common with pagan myths than with Judaism.

It is Paul who started that Jesus was a divine-human person who had descended to Earth from the heavens and experienced death for the express purpose of saving mankind.
A way big difference of though when he got Stephan murder because the later said that Jesus was the son of God. before seeing the light.

The following people listed below that lived on earth during time have all received divine honors, have nearly all been worshiped as Gods, or sons of God; were mostly incarnated as Christs, Saviors, Messiahs, or Mediators. Many were reputedly born of virgins; some of them filling a character almost identical with that ascribed by the Christian's bible to Jesus Christ. Many of them are reported to have been crucified like Jesus.

More than twenty claims of this kind laid the foundation for the salvation of the world, and ascended back to heaven.

Chrishna of Hindostan.
Budha Sakia of India.
Salivahana of Bermuda.
Zulis, or Zhule, also Osiris and Orus, of Egypt.
Odin of the Scaudinavians.
Crite of Chaldea.
Zoroaster and Mithra of Persia.
Baal and Taut, "the only Begotten of God," of Phenicia.
Indra of Thibet.
Bali of Afghanistan.
Jao of Nepaul.
Wittoba of the Bilingonese.
Thammuz of Syria.
Atys of Phrygia.
Xaniolxis of Thrace.
Zoar of the Bonzes.
Adad of Assyria.
Deva Tat, and Sammonocadam of Siam.
Alcides of Thebes.
Mikado of the Sintoos.
Beddru of Japan.
Hesus or Eros, and Bremrillah, of the Druids.
Thor, son of Odin, of the Gauls.
Cadmus of Greece.
Hil and Feta of the Mandaites.
Gentaut and Quexalcote of Mexico.
Universal Monarch of the Sibyls.
Ischy of the Island of Formosa.
Divine Teacher of Plato.
Holy One of Xaca.
Fohi and Tien of China.
Adonis, son of the virgin Io of Greece.
IxiOn and Quirinus of Rome.
Prometheus of Caucasus.
Mohamud, or Mahomet, of Arabia.

The Jews found this doctrine new and shocking and played no role in Jewish scripture.
Paul said that not only this doctrine doctrine was new but added that that every line of the Jewish scripture was a foreshadowing of the Jesus-event as he understood it.
However the early Jewish Christians refused to believe Jesus was divine and were defiant of Paul's Church to accept the divinity of Christ, who never claimed to be God.

The early Christians opposed the tendency to regard Jesus as divine. They laid great stress on the Unity of God as expressed in the original teachings of Jesus and asserted that although he was a prophet, he was essentially a man like other men, even if highly favored by his Lord. The same faith was held by the Churches which had sprung up in North Africa and West Asia.

The Nazarenes first Jewish Christian church never considered Jesus to be divine or the son of God. He was given the messiah ship after his baptism by John.
Messiah ship meaning anointed one.
Christ is the English term for the Greek Χριστός (Khristós) meaning "the anointed one It is a translation of the Hebrew מָשִׁיחַ (Māšîaḥ).

The Nazarenes never accepted the teachings and writings of Paul. In fact, they looked upon Paul as an apostate who was not of pure Jewish blood.

THE RISE OF CONSTANTINE & THE COUNCIL OF NICAEA…THE LOSS OF THE FAITH OF JESUS

The Council of Nicaea 325 AD, summoned by the Emperor Constantine, the Great, was the first ecumenical council to be assembled.
It was the foundation for the creation of a “New Religion” never intended by God nor taught by Jesus.

By 312 AD, Constantine had been at war for six years, and was eager for something to lend his cause extra support. A Christian observer who produced accounts of the event a few years later claimed that Constantine saw a Chi-Rho monogram in a vision on the eve of the battle of the Milvian bridge, accompanied by the words: 'Hoc signo victor eris! By this sign, you shall be the victor.

Whether this vision was actual or dictated by anxiety remains questionable. In any case, he had crosses painted on his army's shields and won the battle, becoming the Emperor of Rome.
This inspired his conversion to Christianity (though not baptized then).
In Milan 313 AD, he issued an Edict of Toleration to all religions. But believing his battleground success to be won with divine providence, he sympathized more with the Christians, who hitherto had suffered sporadic persecution.
The Emperor lavished huge sums of money to build Basilicas and other Churches for them, coupled with preferential treatments of Christian candidates for administrative posts.
In this way, Constantine closed one era and opened another.
CONSTANTINE...CONVERTED YET STILL PAGAN????

Emperor Constantine was happy with the collection of heavenly patrons. He believed reverence for deity to be indispensable for the tranquility of the commonwealth and regarded the Christian God as just another heavenly patron, not incompatible with others although perhaps more powerful. He maintained ties with the Sol Invictus cult (Sun Worship) even after his conversion.



The Council Of Nicaea in 325 AD on the orders of Constantine was there in Nicaea so that he could personally control the proceedings. The Synod took place between June l9th and August 25th. The Emperor summoned all Church leaders with the aim of reaching a consensus over the status of Jesus.

The number of bishops who attended was around 318.

Constantine regarded the religious question exclusively from the angle of political expedience.
His interest was to secure peace rather than any theological verdict.
He had already adopted the Sol Invictus as the state deity, so if Jesus could somehow be deified he would be more easily compatible with Sol Invictus.
As the parties were in conflict, the task of deciding the fate of Jesus was deferred unto Constantine who was theologically incompetent and was inclined to making decisions on inadequate grounds. To him the deification of a man would not have seemed important.
He had his father Constantius deified on his death and expected to be granted the same honor on his demise.

He ruled in favor of Jesus' deification, and demanded that the delegates should sign acceptance to what became known as the Nicene Creed.

This Creed is the first dogmatic definition of the Church and has served as a backbone of Christian orthodoxy through the ages.
It defined the relations of Jesus to the Father within the Godhead as homoousion tot patri (of one substance with the Father) designed specifically to exclude Arianism.
Eusebius of Caesarea writings makes it explicit that the Emperor himself proposed this term.

The delegates that gave assent to the Creed statement were to be invited to stay on at Nicaea as Constantine's guests for his 2Oth Anniversary celebrations, while those who rejected the Creed would be banished.

This is how Jesus got deified.
.
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Postby shadowcass » Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:25 pm

Well, once again I was logged out while composing my response.

But maybe that's a good thing.

I told you previously I didn't care whether anyone accepts the deity and resurrection of Jesus or not. But don't try to put it on Paul.

Peter is the first to proclaim that Jesus is the Son of God (Matthew tells us that). So do all the "demons" He encounters throughout the gospels. He states it Himself and says the proof will be given when He rises from the dead.

The Christian Claim begins with Peter preaching that Christ HAS risen "This Jesus God raised up, and we are all witnesses of it. So then, exalted to the right hand of God, and having received the promise of the Holy Spirit from the Father, he has poured out what you both see and hear..." Acts Chapter 2

If there is to be any more of this we'd best move to the Religion Forum, don'tcha think?

Oh the Message of Christianity has nothing to0 do with any later creeds put about at various councils...it was already there.
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Postby shadowcass » Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:32 pm

Just one MORE thing...if you knew anything about history you'd know the first Christian Churcn above ground was not at Rome and had nothing to do with Catholic tradition or teaching...it was in England...at Glastonbury.

Even the Vatican admits that.

Reluctantly...but they admit it.
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Postby zoltan2 » Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:03 pm

shadowcass wrote:Just one MORE thing...if you knew anything about history you'd know the first Christian Churcn above ground was not at Rome and had nothing to do with Catholic tradition or teaching...it was in England...at Glastonbury.

Even the Vatican admits that.

Reluctantly...but they admit it.



James Jesus brother died 62 and was an important figure in early Christianity.
He is called James the brother of the Lord by Paul (Galatians 1:19), James the Just by Hegesippus and others, James the Righteous, James of Jerusalem, James Adelphotheos, and so on.
There is a lot of correspondence from and about him

First was Peter who was the head of the new Jewish Christian sect then James became the leader of the Christian movement in Jerusalem in the decades after Jesus' death.
The main sources for his life are the Acts of the Apostles, the epistles of Saint Paul, the historian Josephus, and St. Jerome, who also quotes the early Christian author Hegesippus.
The Epistle of James in the New Testament is traditionally attributed to him, and he is a principal author of the Apostolic Decree of Acts 15. He is sometimes said to be the first of the Seventy Apostles
In the Epistle to the Galatians, Paul of Tarsus describes his first visit to Jerusalem where he met James and stayed with Peter.

Jesus brother existed and all attested that Jesus existed.

Please note also back then only very bad slaves and zealots rebels to the Roman Empire were crucified.

Instead of being put to death for blasphemy by the Jews, Jesus was executed by the Romans for a political crime pushed by the Jews.

When the apostle Stephan was put to death for blasphemy by the Jews they did not asked permission from the Romans.
And it was Paul that got Stephan murder know as Saul before his conversion.

One thing we have to keep in mind is that Jesus and the apostles were also political zealots and rebels.
Peter carried a sword.
If Pilate send a cohort of 400 men to arrest Jesus it was because he associated Jesus to the zealots rebels. Also Jesus by admitting that he was the king of the Jews the messiah and heir to the throne of David that was treason and enough in Pilate eyes.

IMO Jesus orchestrated and planed his whole death and did nothing to stop it.
First Jesus and his apostles were zealots rebels of the roman empire later on Jesus also believed that he was the Messiah to get the Jews out of Roman thumb.

The reality is that Jesus had put is own faith and trust in the Old Testament prophecies.
In them he would of found ample justification to beleive that God would not sentence him to death but keep him alive.

Is it not written in scripture ......Though I shall walk in the midst of trouble, you God, will revive me psalm 138:7
And was it not written ........God shall redeem my soul from the grasp of the grave Psalm 30:3.
And did not the Prophet Hosea say : After two days will He revive us and on the third day he will raise us up that we may live in his sight Hosea 6:1-2

Remember that there was the visiting of Moses and Elijah from beyond a and the confirmation to Jesus that no matter what happens there is life after death.
Did not Jesus say that Christ (meaning the anointed one ) had to suffer all these things to enter into his glory.
In the Jewish history there is a pattern that holds up a twofold image of a Jewish hero.
First suffering an initial humiliation then entering glory.

One thing that I find very interesting is the fact that prior to Jesus' death Jesus went on a hill with two apostles and there a bright light appeared and from it came Moses who had been dead for centuries and Elijah that had disappeared into a flaming chariot centuries priory in the sky.
Both now alive centuries latter were chatting with Jesus.

Was Moses clone back to life was Elijah GIVEN SOME SORT OF IMMORTALITY DRUG OR BIOENGINEERING AND WHAT WAS THAT FLAMING VEHICLE OR CLOUD THAT TOOK THEM TO HEAVEN.

Was it God' special vehicle or perhaps some alien vehicle.

Whatever it was, the fact is that people relate seeing Jesus leave in a cloud into the sky.
And he did say I shall come back into the same way.

If he has not come back yet is because it is not the time yet to make his public appearance.
I think its all part of a plan and that there is a very scientific edge to the whole mystery.





J
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Postby shadowcass » Sat Oct 22, 2011 6:58 pm

No...I had posted a response here but I have decided on further reflection to just let you go ahead and babble about whatever you want.

Serious students who may want to learn the true Christian message as it was originally intended by Jesus can come over to my blog at Wordpress...the rest of you can continue to read this bilge about James who was not an apostle and not the brother of Jesus.

One MINOR point...he had access to the "Holy of Holies".

Only the High Priest has such access and THEN only on certain special occasions.

James could only qualify if he were of the Tribe of Levi.

Joseph was of the Tribe of Judah (which is the Tribe of David) that was why he had to go to BETHLEHEM "the City of David" for the census.
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