The Black Vault

Bush has no power behind the scenes, and has remained silent for a year. Cheney is outspoken but has no more clout now than you or I.

Sorry Rath and Sheye but the Honeymoon is over, and The Democrats own all their own mistakes. The free ride off Bush ended with several of his own blunders. Several in the Foriegn affairs department with blunders make dealing directly with Putan and the Iran jerk. I could spell his name if my life depended on it. The ecomonic bail outs were a disaster, that was the Democrats. The cash for junkers was a joke and that was the Democrats. Telling Al Queda a date they could depend on us leaving by was all Obama and ignorant. the deficit is growing by several trillion since Bush--all Obama. Unemployment has still dropped, meaning his economic stimulas failed.

The Democrats can't blame a single Republican, since they control the White House and the Congress. They own their mistakes 100%, and they are failing.

Yeah didn't it go from a 1trillion to 3trillion in one year?
I'm all for supporting Obama, but those numbers are pain stakingly atrocious.
Of course we needed to spend some serious money to pump back into the economy but with those numbers and the current condition of our healthcare, employment, education systems, just alot of things in general, how does he plan to move forward without being unrealistic about the spending endeavors? I know when Bush got into office the deficit was only what something like 100billion, maybe Im way off, and look at what he put us through.

Has unemplyment still dropped? hmm I'd like to see those numbers.

Sadly I think Obama is not going to live up to expectations, however, I do believe he is in office at the right time, I think some peoples minds will change of this, atleast he is a compassionate person, yes, that does count for something.

greeney2 wrote:The free ride off Bush ended with several of his own blunders.

Yes I agree, but you can't deny Bush screwed things up first with that first Bail-out,

I'd like to change the figures slightly to show % per-head o population in comparison to the rest of the world, i recon the US would be in pretty decent shape then, rather than GDP (which I'm pretty sure in saying can be counted in different ways to give you different numbers).


The Half-Caste has still screwed things up though.




Edit: Has anyone noticed that things get worse when Centre-Left gets in? It does every time in Europe but I'll do some research into the US and see if it's the same story there as well, it probably is.

How can people keep bashing Obama for trying to fix this mess? The last administration completely screwed all of us over and people aren't even giving Obama a chance. He can't come in and fix all of these problems over night. If Obama did anything at least he helped save Wall Street from completely collapsing otherwise we'd be even in worse shape. What's the guy supposed to do wave a magic wand and make everything better over night?

There's things that I completely disagree that Obama has done but frankly he's a hell of a lot better than Dick Cheney who was running this country during the last administration. Frankly as Sandra mentioned, we do need to revamp and fix the problems of education, healthcare, unemployment and lastly energy. All of these are related but people can't figure it out. I'm still mixed on healthcare because I would like a public OPTION in the bill but if it does get rid of pre-existing conditions I'd be happy. Unless you go through it you have no idea how bad it is to fight with pre-existing conditions. Heck I know, I've done nothing but deal with medical issues over the last year, thank goodness for Cobra otherwise I'd be paying off my MRI bill for another three years, luckily it was only $1200 instead of $5000 without the insurance. It would of been nice to have the public option when I got laid off for 2 1/2 months when I went to the doctor and my insurance company used that as an excuse for my other medical conditions and denied me coverage until I paid back Cobra so I wouldn't go broke.

Before I ramble to much longer, give the guy a break! Cheney had eight years to screw up this country and Obama barely gets a year to try and fix this problem? It's amazing for how things change in a matter of a few years. When the GOP was controlling the Government it was unpatriotic to go against their policies. Now it's another story when the Dems control Washington. If the GOP gets back into power at least I'll be able to hold a rally and drop a tea bag into a bucket of water and call it a protest. Man I just hope Sarah Palin never gets into the White House, imagine her in international relations and dealing with Achminijad, shudders at the thought.

nightwolf wrote:How can people keep bashing Obama for trying to fix this mess? The last administration completely screwed all of us over and people aren't even giving Obama a chance. He can't come in and fix all of these problems over night. If Obama did anything at least he helped save Wall Street from completely collapsing otherwise we'd be even in worse shape. What's the guy supposed to do wave a magic wand and make everything better over night?

Anyone with even an inch of financial knowledge would tell you that the recession long ago and he couldn't have stopped it, not that anyone is saying he could have, but I disagree with the way he's bailed the banks and the motor industry out.

He wasn't going to fix this mess in a year and we wont know how much he fixed it for the next three or four years.

Lashmar wrote:

nightwolf wrote:How can people keep bashing Obama for trying to fix this mess? The last administration completely screwed all of us over and people aren't even giving Obama a chance. He can't come in and fix all of these problems over night. If Obama did anything at least he helped save Wall Street from completely collapsing otherwise we'd be even in worse shape. What's the guy supposed to do wave a magic wand and make everything better over night?

Anyone with even an inch of financial knowledge would tell you that the recession long ago and he couldn't have stopped it, not that anyone is saying he could have, but I disagree with the way he's bailed the banks and the motor industry out.

He wasn't going to fix this mess in a year and we wont know how much he fixed it for the next three or four years.

Of course the recession started long ago, that's obvious by now! I agree with you on bailing out the big banks because frankly they just had to much power. Even though I think the right thing to do was to bailout our auto industry only for the sake that more manufacturing jobs would of been lost. I'm in the trucking industry and I can tell you how bad things were getting and have gotten. Things are slowly starting to pick up right now. At least we both can agree on the fact that none of us will know how good he's done until a few years from now. Only if there were more Americans who could understand that!

nightwolf wrote:At least we both can agree on the fact that none of us will know how good he's done until a few years from now. Only if there were more Americans who could understand that!

Yes that's true.


I think as well the major problem is the fact in the US you have Private Healthcare. We could have let the banks go to the wall in this country and, to be honest, we wouldn't have noticed too much but that would have crushed the people in the US.

This is a simple case of the US system being built in such a way that the people with money (banks) never feel the squeeze.

We can lose our jobs, we can lose our homes, we can lost everything but yet we will always have what's important to us (Health and Education) and we don't have to pay much for it either. This is a case of a system being soooooo capitalist that it holds everyone to ransom when it fails...for the banks it's a win-win situation.

Lashmar wrote:

nightwolf wrote:At least we both can agree on the fact that none of us will know how good he's done until a few years from now. Only if there were more Americans who could understand that!

Yes that's true.


I think as well the major problem is the fact in the US you have Private Healthcare. We could have let the banks go to the wall in this country and, to be honest, we wouldn't have noticed too much but that would have crushed the people in the US.

This is a simple case of the US system being built in such a way that the people with money (banks) never feel the squeeze.

We can lose our jobs, we can lose our homes, we can lost everything but yet we will always have what's important to us (Health and Education) and we don't have to pay much for it either. This is a case of a system being soooooo capitalist that it holds everyone to ransom when it fails...for the banks it's a win-win situation.

Exactly, people don't joke around and call us "land of the fee," for nothing! Heard that one on Bill Maher and it was a perfect joke for this thread! It's just sad that most people in tihs country think capitalism will fix everything for us like healthcare, education and other programs we need. For how bad education has gotten in this country, just look at our health care debate. If a government run health insurance plan is so bad, it's too bad that the GOP aren't willing to give up their coverage and get it through Blue Cross Blue Shield like the rest of us! Most of the American population can't understand the meaning of the word option!

The only thing that helped was actually Bush's TARP. The first and only one he did.
We would have been out of the reccession months ago if we just let the system clean itself up.Let fail who need to fail, someone else would have stepped in.

The US Government had no constitutional right to jump in and prop up companies they chose.It's picking winners and losers.

Look at the banks, he forced most of them to take the bailout, then he demonized them,most have paid back the bailout with interest, then he threatened to tax them. Fannie and Freddy, are of course exempt from this, when they where the biggest problem to our economy.

The problem with Obama is he is doing everything he can to stunt growth of business, therefor killing any potential job creator. He should be doing the complete opposite of everything he has tried.
I am convinced he is just paying off his base to stay for term 2. Complete cronyism.

I will continue to say blaming Bush is blaming the wrong guy.




BloodStone....

BloodStone wrote:We would have been out of the reccession months ago if we just let the system clean itself up.Let fail who need to fail, someone else would have stepped in.

But that's what I'm saying my friend. We could have let the banks go to the wall...the US couldn't. If they went to the wall then many people in the US would have been in trouble becuase they wouldn't have been able to pay for things like Healthcare and things like that.

I would have loved to see them fall apart to be honest with you...I really would have.