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How does the US benefit from it's relationship w Israel?

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Postby CodeBlack » Sat Jun 13, 2009 6:17 pm

Nesaie wrote:The crap spouted about "islamo-fascist" is nothing but propaganda, said by those either paid or too stupid to see propaganda.

Uh, its not crap. These people are fundamentalist radical Muslems and they are very dedicated to violence. Have you not been paying attention the last 8 years?

Nesaie wrote:Before England meddled in Palestine the Muslims and Jews lived side by side without this crap. In India today, Christians, Hindus, and Muslims live side by side and share food over their fences after holidays.

Ok now, whose fault is the Palestinian problem again? I'm getting confused. I thought it was Israel's.

Nesaie wrote:When the US has wanted a more secular friend in the Middle East, we befriended Saddam.

That's a gross over-simplification. Why is it that when the US tries to get rid of tyrants the left bitches that we are meddling and when we don't get rid of them we are accused of supporting tyrants? You can't have it both ways. Last time I checked it was the US that got rid of Saddam.

Nesaie wrote:It's all crap. If we want to "spread democracy", then let the people of the Middle East decide their own governments and what happens to their resources.

And doing that is what got Iraq Saddam! Doing that is what got Iran Ahmadinejad and Russia Putin and N. Korea Kim Jong Il.
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Postby Nesaie » Sat Jun 13, 2009 9:48 pm

Fundamentalists of all religions are crazy. It isn't limited to Islam. Neither is fascism, which is what the US lives under. So, again, the term "islamo-fascist" is propaganda. It has nothing to do with Islam nor does it have anything to do with fascism, which is what we Americans live under. True Capitalism is illegal in this country. I personally would like to see Capitalism in this country, it works. But, that is for another topic.

If you're confused about Palestine, you haven't read enough yet. Here let me give you more resources (from a Christian perspective): http://www.palestine-encyclopedia.com/

Am I left? Am I right?

Why befriend tyrants in the first place? We don't need them. Why did Saddam love Reagan? Why did the Reagan administration support everything Saddam did? It isn't simplification. It is the US's MO. We create our own enemies, just as our illegitimate government is doing today with "home grown terrorists". Just remember, if you support the Constitution, you're a "right wing extremist".

Oh yeah, it was "Saddam's people who killed him". That's why he was in Gitmo, right? :roll:
Such a society would be dominated by an elite, unrestrained by traditional values. Soon it will be possible to assert almost continuous surveillance over every citizen... - Zbigniew Brezhinsky
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Postby screamzero » Sun Jun 14, 2009 12:30 am

Ya..ite...wh'tevr u say :? Image
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Postby screamzero » Sun Jun 14, 2009 12:34 am

WHICH MUSLIM COUNTRY
ALLOWS JEWS
TO VOTE NESTRIG!!!!!
:P

Israel allows Muslims to vote and live freely within Her borders; and Arabs....and Palestinians....and Iranians...and whites....
and blacks....and Puerto Ricans...and... ...and...religionS...
AND POLITICIANS...and philosophers....aND FREEDOMs...and..
...blah blah ad infinitum...
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Postby mael » Sun Jun 14, 2009 6:50 am

screamzero wrote:Netlie, why are you so weird? Did not Christ say one man's meat is
another man's poison? ..or is He a bit too Jewish for you?..or maybe
not Jewish enough? (wow..what a concept :!: )

There are Indians that chase field rats into brush
fires for din din...would you like one? (Not the Indian silly,
a BBQ rat :roll: .)

Are you denying that Israel has
returned your "stolen" taxes a thousand fold? Is it more proof
you need to convince you the lie you preach is so hollow? Did you
not read the results of the scientific survey propounded by facts?
You'll find it in my last post in this string honey pie.

Is your course in life to veil the reality of true honor, reciprocative
and civil above board politics and international cooperation?
You know the whole world has totally benefited from the medical
and agribusiness these two benefactors (Israel did a lot with this;
'member the green houses they gifted the Palestinins
...that Hamas destroyed?...just an itty bitty example ;) )... these
breakthroughs were shared and released to all humanity.
OR... do you "patriotically" serve up instead
subversive rhetoric for religious fanatics whose only organized
effort is that they excel in suicide?!? Is this why your a hybrid
left wing Libertarian? How quasi.

Are you really comparing the medical, military, humanistic, scientific,
agribusiness and agricultural groundbreaking breakthroughs and
technologically superior advancements beyond excellence that Israel
and America veraciously excel in and dominate?....which has proffered
America with BILLIONS of dollars real and in savings effectively returning
your "stolen" tax money better than a thousand fold? Or does that just
piss you off...that doesn't piss you off, does it? You should be feeling
much better by now...in spite of our Prez Obumer's Fav pastime exploits.

Or are your really wanting to
downplay these Truths and Facts?... for the benefits of the truly screwed
and abused laymen Palestinians that are fed and then blown up by their
charitable Hamas? ...the predatory "underdog" you praise and fend for
so vigorously.

What would be your reasoning for wanting to slander and squelch fact of
undeniable humanity and civil breakthroughs shared by the brilliance of
Jewish and American scientists that over whelm the ignorance of man with
benefits that have never been matched in history? does the good of it
rea-a-ly bother
you? ...I mean..you know...irritate?!?!?

Have you a wise insight for shrouding real progress with argumentative smoke
and contentious and distracting declarations that aren't productive? Your not very
skilled at such subversive propaganda.

I can teach you very, very well...but you must be willing to open your eyes. Here's your first
lesson: Just speak the Truth. There...that's easy enough isn't it? I mean...your
tongue doesn't swell up and GaG you or nothin' when you do...that...does it sweety?

I can also suggest a 12 step program that can help a great deal...oh..my...for the life
of me; we all know what that is don't we :) ...sorta like we rea-a-aly know what's
the truth from the false..unless, of course, there really is a problem; but
......... there is a solution to that as well. I'm relieved, aren't you?
Have heart...recourse is at hand. Have a nice day dear.

Oh!..P.S. Why don't you click the second link of my signature and
listen to the last four or five of my relaxing piano songs I wrote.
Their good for your nerves...really.

Plus you'll get to see my face (see? I ain't a skeered!) and smile and
look straight into my eyes...take a good look at your future potential mentor
and see a real heart that sanely gives a damn...go ahead...plus the tunes
will do you well...
their very relaxing... the serenity will do you s-o-o-o much good. I promise.
I recommend African Rain and Spanish Clippers or The Edge of Blue.


Are paid by each word? Or are you paid by the hour? Or do you have overseers evaluating your propaganda on message boards?

I think you must be paid by each word judging by your typical verbose and vacuous 'literary' offerings. But what about all those bits of words and disjointed letters you like to add? Are they counted as words?
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Postby screamzero » Sun Jun 14, 2009 7:39 am

Actually, ringwerm, your just overwhelmed by my abilities to articulate skillfully. You and another or so of the nut jobbers around here have merely assumed I am so skilled at "propaganda" that I should be paid. As you well know there have been a number of times this skill potential has been pointed out to me.

You squids naturally ass-u-me I must be paid or it. Thank you...at first I wasn't aware of how truly adroit I was at word smithing. It's a fact that at some (non-political) gatherings I have been queried as to why I don't write a book on a couple of varied subjects (type 2 diabetes; philosophy; and other perspectives) I seemed to have adroitly expressed myself in. Thanks for the pat on he back...old bean. I might make a buck yet at word smithing. Your support is priceless. Thank you again.

You know what meal? I do believe I've even improved at this since our (and other's verbose challenges since even from the beginning w/ the schemer persona) first ever tryst here at the B.V.
Just think of it. If it weren't for the innate brilliance of the B.V. you and i would have never realized some more of the true potential I unwittingly boast. Thanks again meal. Your a true pal.

Look friend, share some of the glory with netlie, hex. the nook canuke, 'puter guy, etc...they deserve some credit too ya know. ;)
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Postby CodeBlack » Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:19 am

Nesaie wrote:Fundamentalists of all religions are crazy. It isn't limited to Islam. Neither is fascism, which is what the US lives under.

Sorry but that is irrelevant. And not all fundamentalists are crazy.

Nesaie wrote:So, again, the term "islamo-fascist" is propaganda.

I disagree. Ahmadinejad and his Ayatolla backers are Islamo-Fascists. The Taliban is Islamo-Fascist. Saddam was Fascist-Islamo when it was convenient.

Nesaie wrote:True Capitalism is illegal in this country. I personally would like to see Capitalism in this country, it works. But, that is for another topic.

Ok, we agree on that.

Nesaie wrote:Am I left? Am I right?

Well, you are espousing an opinion that is part of the left wing crusade.

Nesaie wrote:Why befriend tyrants in the first place? We don't need them. Why did Saddam love Reagan? Why did the Reagan administration support everything Saddam did? It isn't simplification. It is the US's MO. We create our own enemies, just as our illegitimate government is doing today with "home grown terrorists". Just remember, if you support the Constitution, you're a "right wing extremist".

That is absolutely over-simplification. You have to be smart enough to understand that governments have to deal with other governments and the enemy of my enemy sometimes has to be my friend. Saddam was resistance against Iran. He kept the oil flowing and all the other players would have stopped the oil if they replaced Saddam. The US had no choice but to deal with him. Besides its all academic, the US took out Saddam in the end.
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Postby CodeBlack » Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:22 am

Remember, Saddam was cheating on the OPEC agreements and over supplying oil. This angered the left in the US who wanted to get rid of oil, and still do, are, will. That's why the left voted for the war before they voted against it. They wanted Saddam gone and they wanted the right to take the blame. Looks like it worked. Without the left the Iraq war would never have happened.
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Postby mael » Sun Jun 14, 2009 12:39 pm

screamzero wrote:Actually, ringwerm, your just overwhelmed by my abilities to articulate skillfully.


* No! But dream on.

* I see you impress yourself.

You and another or so of the nut jobbers around here have merely assumed I am so skilled at "propaganda" that I should be paid. As you well know there have been a number of times this skill potential has been pointed out to me.


* You have misinterpreted the comments and taken them as compliments. My inquiries were along the lines of if you are a paid propagandist then they'd get much better value from me rather than pay you for your verbose & vacuous literary abortions.

You squids naturally ass-u-me I must be paid or it. Thank you...at first I wasn't aware of how truly adroit I was at word smithing.


* Think again. :)

It's a fact that at some (non-political) gatherings I have been queried as to why I don't write a book on a couple of varied subjects (type 2 diabetes; philosophy; and other perspectives) I seemed to have adroitly expressed myself in. Thanks for the pat on he back...old bean. I might make a buck yet at word smithing. Your support is priceless. Thank you again.


* They probably suggested it in sympathy because it's never going to happen and it sounds a nice thing to say to a person with 'challenges' like you. Kind sorts, y'kno'.

You know what meal? I do believe I've even improved at this since our (and other's verbose challenges since even from the beginning w/ the schemer persona) first ever tryst here at the B.V.


* Well the alternative, which would be that you hadn't improved would be too disappointing to contemplate.

Just think of it. If it weren't for the innate brilliance of the B.V. you and i would have never realized some more of the true potential I unwittingly boast. Thanks again meal. Your a true pal.


* Most welcome. :? :roll:

Look friend, share some of the glory with netlie, hex. the nook canuke, 'puter guy, etc...they deserve some credit too ya know. ;)


* Your contributions here don't even merit a blip on a graph which shows any sign of an intelligent debate. To celebrate your improvements would be akin to saying "What a clever lickle boy you are." - When you don't wet the bed. :)

Please, go on. I'm enjoying our conversation. Really, I mean it. Please keep going. You are better than TV. 8-)
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Postby Aquatank » Sun Jun 14, 2009 9:27 pm

Screamzero
I'm happy to finally see a well thought out response from you on page 8, I hope to see more of that from you in the future.

You numbered points however indicate a disturbing trend though as the main benefit outside a common shared history is an exchange of monies for weaponry which only benfits the USA military industrial complex. Thusly it is in that US cartel's interest to keep the conflict in the Middleast alive. 41+% of all international arms trade originate in the USA, hence the USA is the pusher for drugs of war addiction. Yet the Middleast feeds the USA's own addiction to petroleum and we pay no attention to the crimes that are hidden from our view to acquire it ( such as what Shell has done in Nigeria and elsewhere http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2009/06/14-0 )

Also Its my opinion that the 1967 line is defensible, otherwise Israel could not have gained territory in excess of it, but would have lost it.

Once the addiction to petroleum is over, international politics will be forced to evolve, even the arms industry will feel the hit. Oil is a specialized niche for users and suppliers, those places that fail to adapt to such a future will fail while those that adapt will succeed. Such drastic changes spell doom for the current status quo in the Middleast, to adapt and survive both the Israelis and the Arab nations must not only find peace but must be come fast friends in a treaty alliance that erases past hatreds and feuds. The first step to such a strong Middleeast is the two nation-state solution. But after all that friendship is finally secure, the Middleast must become self sustaining and find a product worth trading since oil will be nearly worthless. If this can be done, the Israelis and the Arabs might be able to form a strong enough power block to stabilize their region without interlopers. If they don't adapt to gether they'll probably all fall to more war, poverty, and multitudes of militant extremism from factional groups.
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