The Black Vault

Christ knew the pain would be temporary, maybe a few days for the worst of it,...................If I knew for a fact that my death would last for three days and then I would ascend to heaven, I would do everything in my power to start that chain of events.

First off I would think if you have ever been in any kind of pain you would realize that even a minute of excruciating pain is pretty darn unbearable. I would think that "knowing" what was to come did not bring comfort, and per the bible Jesus did ask to not have to bear what was to come. That speaks of separation between him and God(totally different awareness)....however to minimize the pain of a crucifixion seems kind of silly don't you think. If we believe what Christians teach than Jesus embodied the Christ "in the body"....and the body experiences pain and would be considered a sacrifice by Christ for sure. Again going by what they believe Christ could have said the heck with it....but didn't. Instead in mortal form chose to experience the pain and sacrifice at a level man could come to understand.

I also highly doubt if you thought it out for just a moment, you would not do everything in your power to get the ball rolling........sorry I just can't buy that

But coming back to Jesus asking to have this cup taken away.....the Gnostics speak of "Christ" having left the body of Jesus and that it was the man that experienced the pain and sacrifice. That during the baptism that Jesus received at an earlier date is when Christ entered Jesus body to spread the truth....or the way to the kingdom (which is within).

And just maybe...maybe the church back than watered down the truth of the resurrection.

DIss0n80r wrote:He experienced great pain for a very short time and he knew he would be fine after. Isn't that how the story goes? Was he God or not? Is your God omniscient or not?

Christianity doesn't make sense. Since you feel you need it for whatever reasons, you can ignore and gloss over how nonsensical it really is and delude yourself.

It's easier than dealing with reality.

Ok logical dimwit, lets have a kindergarten lesson in cognition.
You want to read some nonsensical glossy BS than read a book on the scientific hypothesis and position on altruism, cause I tell you what, that is a lot easier than dealing with reality.

Reality- what are the chances we see a church outside our window or on a small stroll? How embedded is christianity comparatively altogether? Why?

Reality- The thought contagion of Christ's life is something that cannot and has not been reckoned with.

Reality- IF science knows something about individualism and competition, hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm take a thinking moment!
I wonder if jesus knew something about individualism and the spirit of competition eh? How dull are you?

Reality- How much has physically manifested in this world out of the cognitive models employed through christianity, and what cognitive functions has religion such as christianity served in overall innovation period?

What the hell is your definition of God? Because I tell you what you might be just as illogical and nonsensical as you think others to be. If you think that people who believe in christ are deluded, how potent is the rest huh because I don't see anyone putting a dent in it in thousands of years as of yet and if you don't know anything about cognition and mental modules and thought contagion and their relation with innovation, culture, evolution etc.. you are a little mistaken about validity.

DIss0n80r wrote:What does that even mean? I cared enough to read your posts and to ask. You don't have to answer, of course. You can answer and I will read the answer, and yes, I will probably still disagree and have more questions and opinions.

What is soo original about you exactly ? You don't even see past appearances. Obviously not, because somehow you believe you are some type of different person, and I fail to see anything peculiar about you or anything you have to say. Clearly you know very little about "purpose". Maybe too much about a lot of empty thoughts though.

qmark wrote:

at1with0 wrote:

qmark wrote:The fact that He knew He would be resurrected is immaterial.

I absolutely disagree.

I guess, by following that line of thinking, the only one that can sacrifice themself is an atheist.

Nope, just saying that if I know for a fact that I will resurrect in three days, laying down my "life" ain't much of a risk or sacrifice. If Jesus was to be completely annihilated and forever terminated upon his death, then yes that would be an actual sacrifice.

inja wrote:First off I would think if you have ever been in any kind of pain you would realize that even a minute of excruciating pain is pretty darn unbearable. I would think that "knowing" what was to come did not bring comfort,

Compare the two situations: The Biblical Jesus in the hands of the torturer and a POW in a Viet Kong stockade.

The first person KNOWS that within a few days they are going to die but also resurrect and live with God forever in heavenly bliss. The second, there for who knows how long, has no hope of a rescue, divine or otherwise.

Knowing what is to come in those types of situations can be the only thing that keeps you sane, so yes knowing what is to come matters immensely.

Sandra, good luck with that.

Moving on, qmark failed to answer any of my reasonable questions and instead made excuses and bowed out. My questions on the last page are still there but the christians here are probably going to fill this thread with babble to rush it past those questions, or maybe they'll ignore the thread entirely.

qmark wrote:It is finished - means my participation in this thread has come to a conclusion. I have said everything I wanted to say.

I know you meant you were quitting. I asked what you meant by saying I don't care. It's such a useless thing for you to say, except to give you a quick excuse to avoid answering my questions and explaining your views as I asked. In what sense should I be "caring" here, in order to satisfy you enough to respond?

You could have just said that you couldn't explain it to me, and I would have respected that more than this weak cop-out you pulled. But you were looking for a quick way out, I suppose.

DIss0n80r wrote:Sandra, good luck with that.

I was really hoping for some psychoanalysis. Apparently you don't have the references for that.

Stop trolling now Disson80r!

greeney2 wrote:Stop trolling now Disson80r!

This is one of the few threads s/he is not trolling.