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Will Obama Block Release of Key Bush-Era Torture Memos?

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Postby Jaack » Tue Apr 21, 2009 9:28 pm

Nesaie wrote:Torture is illegal.

Waterboarding is torture.

Simple logic.


By your definition, but not by mine.

Waterboarding saved LA from a 911 style attack.

Plus waterboarding is not torture.
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Postby Nesaie » Tue Apr 21, 2009 11:11 pm

The Army seems to agree with me.

Army reiterates ban on waterboarding

By Pamela Hess - The Associated Press
Posted : Tuesday Nov 13, 2007 20:13:26 EST

WASHINGTON — With Congress’ approval of a new attorney general who refused to describe waterboarding as torture, the Army has sent out a message to its leaders repeating that the interrogation technique is prohibited in the military.

The service issued the Nov. 6 message “to eliminate any confusion that may have arisen as a result of recent public discourse on the subject.”

The U.S. military formally banned waterboarding as an interrogation technique in September 2006.

However, at Senate confirmation hearings last month, then-attorney general nominee Michael Mukasey repeatedly refused to say whether he considers waterboarding a form of torture, as claimed by an unlikely coalition of military officials, doctors and human rights groups.

Waterboarding is a technique that involves strapping down a prisoner, covering his mouth with plastic or cloth and pouring water over his face. The prisoner quickly begins to inhale water, causing the sensation of drowning.

The Army issued a “strategic communication hot topic” alert to its senior leaders two days before the Senate confirmed Mukasey, asking them to make sure every soldier, family member and Army civilian employee understands the ban on waterboarding. Mukasey was sworn in Nov. 9.

“The U.S. Army strictly prohibits the use of waterboarding during intelligence investigations by any of its members. It is specifically prohibited by Field Manual 2-22.3 and is not a sanctioned interrogation technique in any training manual or any instructions to soldiers in the field,” the statement says.

Mukasey’s refusal to define waterboarding as torture came in response to senators’ questions about the CIA’s alleged use of the technique. It is believed the CIA used the technique on three prisoners, the last time in 2003. Air Force Gen. Michael Hayden, director of the CIA, prohibited the use of waterboarding in CIA interrogations in 2006.

If Mukasey confirmed that waterboarding is torture, it could have put the CIA interrogators and possibly the chain of command above them in legal peril. Torture is illegal both under U.S. and international law.

Defense Secretary Robert Gates reiterated the military ban at a press conference on Nov. 1.

“The fact is, it’s not a permitted technique under the Army Field Manual, and therefore, no member of the U.S. military is allowed to do it, period,” he said.

Gates would not say whether he believes the banned technique amounts to torture.

“I am not going to wander into that legal thicket,” he said.


Which manual are you reading? Certainly not one that is legal by military standards.
Such a society would be dominated by an elite, unrestrained by traditional values. Soon it will be possible to assert almost continuous surveillance over every citizen... - Zbigniew Brezhinsky
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Postby Jaack » Tue Apr 21, 2009 11:44 pm

Now whats great is the fu-king AG who earlier let real terrorists offf the hook is the one to decide to prosecute patriots.

This Dear Reader is a sick fu-king joke and the whole left is a twisted fate who need to continually be defeated.

WAKE UP AMERICA THE SOCIALISTS ARE HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Postby Nesaie » Tue Apr 21, 2009 11:48 pm

Are you calling the Army and the men and women who serve in the Army UN-patriotic???? :shock:
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Postby Jaack » Tue Apr 21, 2009 11:50 pm

Nesaie wrote:Are you calling the Army and the men and women who serve in the Army UN-patriotic???? :shock:


For the military, the Army sure. Waterboarding was only used in a few very specific situations.

And no I'm calling the left unpatriotic.
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Postby Tairaa » Thu Apr 23, 2009 10:19 am

"The left" "Leftists" "Lefties"

In other words people who disagree with you.

Yet you're the one against privacy?
Who is unpatriotic?

I bet you work for the government don't you? :P
"George Bush says he speaks to god every day, and christians love him for it. If George Bush said he spoke to god through his hair dryer, they would think he was mad. I fail to see how the addition of a hair dryer makes it any more absurd."
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Postby Jaack » Thu Apr 23, 2009 8:10 pm

One of the biggest squawkers is on the hot seat of factual reality for once. I'm sure Mainstream [codeword for leftist] Media will help cover for her she's Nanacy S T R E T C H Pelosi for sakes.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/glennthru ... n_02_.html


April 23, 2009
Categories: Pelosi
Pelosi briefed on waterboarding in '02 [UPDATED]

Nancy Pelosi denies knowing U.S. officials used waterboarding — but GOP operatives are pointing to a 2007 Washington Post story which describes an hour-long 2002 briefing in which Pelosi was told about enhanced interrogation techniques in graphic detail.

Two unnamed officials told the paper that Pelosi, then a member of the Democratic minority, didn't raise substantial objections.

Joby Warrick and Dan Eggen wrote:

In September 2002, four members of Congress met in secret for a first look at a unique CIA program designed to wring vital information from reticent terrorism suspects in U.S. custody. For more than an hour, the bipartisan group, which included current House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), was given a virtual tour of the CIA's overseas detention sites and the harsh techniques interrogators had devised to try to make their prisoners talk.

Among the techniques described, said two officials present, was waterboarding, a practice that years later would be condemned as torture by Democrats and some Republicans on Capitol Hill. But on that day, no objections were raised. Instead, at least two lawmakers in the room asked the CIA to push harder, two U.S. officials said.

UPDATE: A Pelosi spokesman passes along her response to the article when it first appeared, claiming that Pelosi's successor on the intel committee -- Yep, Jane Harman -- lodged a protest with the CIA when she learned waterboarding was in use.

"On one occasion, in the fall of 2002, I was briefed on interrogation techniques the Administration was considering using in the future. The Administration advised that legal counsel for the both the CIA and the Department of Justice had concluded that the techniques were legal.

I had no further briefings on the techniques. Several months later, my successor as Ranking Member of the House Intelligence Committee, Jane Harman, was briefed more extensively and advised the techniques had in fact been employed. It was my understanding at that time that Congresswoman Harman filed a letter in early 2003 to the CIA to protest the use of such techniques, a protest with which I concurred."

Lower down in the article, the authors and their sources acknowledge Pelosi & Co. were severely constrained in what they could do with the information — and had no way of knowing how the techniques would ultimately used or abused in a pre-Abu Gharaib era.

Congressional officials say the groups' ability to challenge the practices was hampered by strict rules of secrecy that prohibited them from being able to take notes or consult legal experts or members of their own staffs. And while various officials have described the briefings as detailed and graphic, it is unclear precisely what members were told about waterboarding and how it is conducted. Several officials familiar with the briefings also recalled that the meetings were marked by an atmosphere of deep concern about the possibility of an imminent terrorist attack.

"In fairness, the environment was different then because we were closer to Sept. 11 and people were still in a panic," said one U.S. official present during the early briefings. "But there was no objecting, no hand-wringing. The attitude was, 'We don't care what you do to those guys as long as you get the information you need to protect the American people.'"

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Postby Nesaie » Thu Apr 23, 2009 11:01 pm

Jaack wrote:
Nesaie wrote:Are you calling the Army and the men and women who serve in the Army UN-patriotic???? :shock:


For the military, the Army sure.


Are you saying the soldiers in the Army are unpatriotic?
Such a society would be dominated by an elite, unrestrained by traditional values. Soon it will be possible to assert almost continuous surveillance over every citizen... - Zbigniew Brezhinsky
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Postby Jaack » Thu Apr 23, 2009 11:11 pm

Nesaie wrote:
Jaack wrote:
Nesaie wrote:Are you calling the Army and the men and women who serve in the Army UN-patriotic???? :shock:


For the military, the Army sure.


Are you saying the soldiers in the Army are unpatriotic?


Noo miss dense. The military not being able to waterboard. The technique was never approved for the military use so good for them for not going against orders.
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Postby Nesaie » Thu Apr 23, 2009 11:22 pm

Tairaa wrote:"The left" "Leftists" "Lefties"

In other words people who disagree with you.

Yet you're the one against privacy?
Who is unpatriotic?

I bet you work for the government don't you? :P


Awe kid, don't get into that left/right propaganda. There really is no left/right. It is a tactic used by the media and spin doctors to evoke emotion in people. For many, they fall into the trap. But, I know you're smarter than that. ;)

I keep asking people around here how much they get paid. In 2006 the main stream media publicized the fact that the pentagon had to create a new division to "correct" news stories. In the articles I met blogs were mentioned. I suspect public forums like this one are included. Especially ones based on UFOs and conspiracy. Of course, this is all at American tax payer expense. Probably one of those "black" projects that is a sink hole for taxes.

How much do you think they get paid? If it's minimum wage, I don't want the job. I'd rather work for a private restaurant owner. But, if it's six figures...I might...ah who am I kidding...I could never sell my soul to paper to lie. I have ethics. I'm still having a hard enough time dealing with the fact I work for a corporation. I may need to go back to a small independently owned company again.
Such a society would be dominated by an elite, unrestrained by traditional values. Soon it will be possible to assert almost continuous surveillance over every citizen... - Zbigniew Brezhinsky
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