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Does Pre destiny exist?

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Postby Guest » Tue Sep 01, 2009 4:56 pm

Hi,

I've been busy reading a "old" book {1990} by William Bramley called THE GODS OF EDEN. It tell a different tale of History and the reason behind Religion. There's this one part taken from the book which I think gives an excellent "test" to prove there is no such thing as Pre destiny. Take a few moments to read the following. What do you think?

Quote:
Does predestiny really exist?
For the sake of discussion, let us assume that it does: at
any given moment in the present, there is a future already
created that is as solid and as real as any moment in the
past or present. Perhaps time is not as linear as we have
believed.
If such a future already exists, does that mean that it is
inevitable and must occur?
No.
Here is a simple two-part exercise to illustrate this:
Part 1: Find a timepiece and note the time. Calculate what
time it will be in exactly 30 seconds. Now decide exactly
where you will be standing when that 30-second moment
arrives. Watch the clock and be sure you are standing at the
spot you chose.
You have just created a prophecy and fulfilled it.
Part 2: Look at the clock again and decide on a new
location. Ten seconds before the 30-second moment arrives,
rethink whether you want to fulfill the prophecy. If you do,
be at the place you decided upon; if you do not, choose a
new location at random and be there when the 30-second
moment arrives.
Repeat the above exercise several times.
Which of the two parts above created the stronger and
more solid future? The answer, of course is Part 1. Which
of the two futures would a prophet be more likely to foresee?
The answer again is Part 1. The point being made is that the
future is shaped largely by intention backed by action: the
stronger the intention and the better its back-up by action,
the more solid the future will tend to be.
The future is therefore malleable. A future reality, no
matter how solid it is or how many prophets have agreed to
its existence, can be changed. It will be irreversible only if
people continue to perform, or fail to perform, those actions
which will cause that future to come about, and no one does anything effective enough to counter those actions or inaction's.


Personally I don't believe in Pre destiny. I believe that we create our future by what we do now in this present. When I read this I had to share it, since I know that some religions do practice and believe in Pre destiny, I think the views shared here could be interesting.

Item7
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Postby Dark-Samus » Thu Sep 03, 2009 12:11 am

Hmmm if Pre Destiny would exist, I would enjoy it because I would know what I would become later. :twisted:
Truth doesn´t control you, you control it...
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Postby humphreys » Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:20 am

I don't believe in pre-destiny either, but the experiment he cites is silly, and doesn't prove anything.

The answer lies in the existence or non-existence of free-will. if we have free-will here and now, then pre-destiny cannot exist. If we do not have free-will, then it can exist, but it is impossible to know whether or not it exists.

So, unless we can prove the existence of free-will, which is impossible to do, we can never know whether pre-destiny exists or not.
"All of our behavior can be traced to biological events about which we have no conscious knowledge: this has always suggested that free will is an illusion."

- Sam Harris
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Postby Guest » Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:49 am

I think the exercise demonstrates free will, but that's just me. The person has the choice to either stand where he previously decided or not.

Hey Dark-Samus, that reminds me of an old question dealing with the future..."If you could know your time of death, would you?" Personally I would not want to know because I think it would ruin the time I do have. I'd be marking off the days, Lol.

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Postby Lashmar » Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:54 am

Item7 wrote:I'd be marking off the days, Lol.


I'd be doing the same. :lol:
Read between the lies
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Postby BornAquarius » Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:39 am

Excellent book by William Bramley called THE GODS OF EDEN, think it may be time to read it again.

"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed, second it is violently opposed, and third, it is accepted as self-evident." - Arthur Schopenhauer
"I'm impatient with stupidity. My people have learned to live without it." -- Klaatu in 'The Day the Earth Stood Still'
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Postby humphreys » Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:48 am

Item7 wrote:I think the exercise demonstrates free will, but that's just me. The person has the choice to either stand where he previously decided or not.


He has either experienced free-will, or the illusion of free-will. We know we experience one or the other, but his experiment does no differentiate between them.
"All of our behavior can be traced to biological events about which we have no conscious knowledge: this has always suggested that free will is an illusion."

- Sam Harris
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Postby BornAquarius » Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:56 am

The time experiment in my opinion seems to be intention not prophecy.
"I'm impatient with stupidity. My people have learned to live without it." -- Klaatu in 'The Day the Earth Stood Still'
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Postby Dark-Samus » Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:35 pm

Hey Dark-Samus, that reminds me of an old question dealing with the future..."If you could know your time of death, would you?" Personally I would not want to know because I think it would ruin the time I do have. I'd be marking off the days, Lol.


In my opinion, I`ve also talked about my mom about this.
Seing the future is an illusion.

I mean, Let´s say that you see how you are going to die in a "Flash-Forward" and then you do everything to avoid that situation.
The only problem is that this Sight into the Future, its purpose is to lead the one who sees the future into that situation in the future by making him/her avoid the future.

So in other words, if you continue with your life as normal nothing will happen.
But again, now that you know about your future, everything in your life will be about avoiding the future so in the end, nothing matters because you are already trying to avoid it by heading straight to your death. :lol: :lol: :lol:
Truth doesn´t control you, you control it...
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Postby Dark-Samus » Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:36 pm

Thinking about it, The movie series of Final Destination explains most of what I think about this issue. :mrgreen:
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