The Black Vault

greeney2 wrote:Aren't we all manipulated to some degree, no matter what we learn?

Absolutely and all the time.

I was struck by, was many of these kids felt alienated, and wished they could find friends other than religious kids. Intentional or not, these kids feel alienated. Even some religions not considered cults tend to do this alienating.

Friends of mine unschooled their children (if you are not familiar with the term it is a form of homeschooling) and they sent their children every year to a Christian camp as well as a non Christian camp as well as an unschooling camp. Her son who is now a young adult made a video interviewing the kids that went to the camp for unschoolers. They too often felt alienated in their lives where the camp aloud them to be themselves without question as well as make friends, even if it meant long distance friendships, to feel and experience a belonging. This camp consists of faith and non faith. Man likes to feel that they belong and being young the feeling of being alienated comes in all forms from being bullied, being too sensitive or in this case an atheist.

Its a tough call if you consider a Christian camp an equal effort of brainwashing, when this example of Atheists replacing words "God and Lord", with fantasy names, and a drilling the idea God is imaginary, than telling kids "you are free to decide for yourself", while they deal a stacked deck.

I did not see the the show you are referring to but I will agree that if imaginary names are used and than stating God does not exist but we want you to make up your own mind.....is contradictory for sure.

If I think about it objectively, I could think the deck is equally stacked on the Christian side of planting their seeds. I think what tips the scales completly however to the Christian side not, is these are (ministers and clergy) people who have studied in depth to understand the Bible, and are Ordained in the Faiths they belong to. It is their lifes work, and they teach in order to understand and tie things togather completly out of the Bible. Which is differnt than teaching finding counterdictions, and not taking into account the entire scope of understanding. You may hate Catholics, but the most highly educated group of people in theology, are the Cardinals of the world in the Catholic religion.

Well I don't hate Catholics. I have no reason too. When my daughter was smaller we did try several churches out and if my daughter liked any church it sure was the Catholic Church. Call and respond, kneel, cross yourself, holy water and the list goes on. She loved it. Now me coming from an objective view could also say even though these rituals have deep meaning for the Catholic one could say that this too is a form of brainwashing. I do not find the educational staff of the Catholic church to be too fool proof, since they have scandals every few decades of the sexual abuse. So while lets say they have an understanding....and I am sure you would say that your faith is timeless....I say they are not keeping up with the times and so with are creating these internal issues all on their own. Celibacy is not for everyone. And it would seem to me that if one has an in depth understanding and belief and it really is so outstanding as an example for all.....somewhere they are failing miserably.

I would say the true Christian camp has an honest approach based on the fact these are people who have passed down centuries of study and learning. It begs the question if I'm honest, how could so many centuries resulting in more than one religion from the same Bible? Thats a pretty big question. I am not so sure that the atheist camp is based on honest and true study of the Bible. Thats just my opinion.

Most atheist I know come from the perspective of logic and science and the bible can only full fill a small portion of that. There is nothing dishonest about that. But again I did not see the show and do not know what was really going on in that camp. But than I also wonder what might have been edited to give you the impression you received.
The bible gets interpreted in different ways with the exception of a few things where you all agree. Just shows you it is not so black and white in many areas. I know that when I do choose to pull out my bible and read it....as I have evolved and matured I read something very differently than what I did lets say 10 or 15 years ago.

The show did not show the kids in any kind of bad light, they were all very nice kids, and just kids like any other group. Teh words like God were taped over and replace with things like the Spagetti Monster, and other fantasy names. The written artical stressed they emphasised the God being imagininary, where the tv special did not mention that to be fair. It was my obsevation that many of the things the kids said and expressed were of the same jargon that you hear from the atheists here. I really question if they are in the camp to study the bible, if they are being taught from a base that does not want to show it in a believable light. Inja my kids in Catholic high school, and in their Confimation years, had well rounded kinds of subjects, and discussions that were open, it was not something shoved down their throats, OR ELSE, kind of thing. Some no doubt are, and I would not have tolerated that.

I was raised Catholic. My grandmother used to take me to church. Don't sit on the right side of the church, was what I remember being told. That was the "Anglo side" of the church. I was hispanic and therefore had to sit on the left side. Although i did not know of Atheism at that time, nobody said I had a choice.
I attended Catechism like everyone I knew and became an Alter Boy til the age of 18.
My first encouter with atheism was when my college Philosophy professor was asked by a student in the class if he believed in God. He said no and the majority of the class seemed to lose respect for him after that. That was shameful because he was a great Professor.
To this day I have never met an Atheist or Agnostic.
In many instances it would take counter brainwashing to undo the engrained societal brainwashing that believers practice on each other. But if a person truly examines the evidence (or lack of) he would come to this conclusion.
There is no proof of a Supreme Being and never has been. He either doesn't exist or chooses to stay hidden. Either of which would contradict the rest of the stories.
CONCLUSION: GOD is a myth. And his followers are Make-Believers.

boastonline wrote:
But if a person truly examines the evidence (or lack of) he would come to this conclusion.
There is no proof of a Supreme Being and never has been. He either doesn't exist or chooses to stay hidden. Either of which would contradict the rest of the stories.
CONCLUSION: GOD is a myth. And his followers are Make-Believers.

There is a very serious problem with this kind of thinking and what I call pseudo intellect out of public schools today.

I say this because of the lack of certain information's and knowledge's which someone wants not to exist or to keep it hidden from us such that we lack the ability to think outside of public school brainwashing of today.

The attempt on many of these sites is to put the onus of everything bad happening in the world on Religion and particularly on Christianity ..going back in a long extended time warp into ancient history.

The problem with that is this...

Democide....death by government.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democide

Particularly this tidbit from the link above....very interesting and telling.

His research shows that the death toll from democide is far greater than the death toll from war. After studying over 8,000 reports of government-caused deaths, Rummel estimates that there have been 262 million victims of democide in the last century. According to his figures, six times as many people have died from the inflictions of people working for governments than have died in battle.

I keep bringing this link and article up in post after post..because Atheists in particular will totally avoid this path of information's and logic while using/misusing the time warp technique of sticking everything back in time for their political/educational/religious purposes. Make that .."Brainwashing purposes."

Note what R. J. Rummel states...about how many people have been killed by their own governments in the last hundred years..not in war..but by their own governments..and Six time more than have died in battle.

That is alot of people in recent times..in times of educated peoples...enlightened peoples...people who are supposed to be aware and highly moral...ethical peoples. I suggest strongly that some rethink education and it's goals in thinking.



Most governments in the history of men are some variation of Feudal Governments. By this I mean Royalty in government with their crowns or titles bestowed on them by Priesthood and a Priestly Grand Poo Bah...who crowned them.

This means that the power of these Kings or Emperors was absolute..or divine right power..from God Himself.
Their absolute power Kings or Emperors were a type of god which could be seen..a type of god with us.

What we see historically is that in any nation which broke out of this kind of absolute power... or divine right of kings/emperors...were nations who recognized that their God was in Heaven and not on a throne on this earth. That a governments power was limited..not absolute.

This is the secret to the economic success of these people and nations. That the power of their governments to interfere in their private daily business was there by ...limited.

This meant northern Germany, England and eventually the USA. Most of the economic and technological progress found in this world was and has been exported from these nations...to other nations. For these nations were the nations which broke out of the Business of Divine Right of Kings or absolute power in the hands of men or a man.

And If you can see and think outside of Public school thinking and brainwashing...you will note that as these nations return back to absolute power in the hands of men ...their economies suffer the same thing they suffered under absolute power kings and emperors. Economies returning back to deadness and inertness.


One of the interesting things I learned about archeology is that of the indexes used to determine if a dig site is of men...is looking for tools and the other is signs of religion...worship. For all men worship...and archeolgists know this.

You have the right religion and progress takes place..the wrong religion and inertness takes place.


Another facet which Atheists ignore about history is what happened in the Godless nations in the last hundred years???

Particularly the Communist nations..and how they treated their people. ..the Communist nations....where the state is god as G. F. W Hegel would go on to quote. What is very interesting here about the Communist nations ...is not that the people did not have a religion .but that the government was not shackled by religion. This is very interesting because Atheists are great believers in the religion and belief in science.

For what is known is so too are the Communists in turning out the Perfect Party man ..by science..by education...the upward reach of mankind.

This ...about science and the communists is why most Atheists will attempt to distance themselves from this template and ignore this history all together while trying to promote science as the cure all and know all for men.


Be Warned of this type of Education or Brainwashing Propaganda..for it is not the product advertised.
For you see the Communists were heavy believers in Science while they were carrying out Democide on their own people.

You have to be publicly educated to not know this ..because they will not teach it. You are never to be able on your own to connect the dots for yourself while worshipping at the altar of the new religion ...Science!!

Be Warned!!!
For this is nothing more than men in all their wisdom playing god by the non virtue of the wisdom religions under different guises.
Demi gods here on earth....and you are right back to absolute power in the hands of men...feudalism/royalty.

Thanks,
Orangetom

boastonline wrote: CONCLUSION: GOD is a myth. And his followers are Make-Believers.

This would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

qmark wrote:This would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

This would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

boastonline wrote:I was raised Catholic. My grandmother used to take me to church. Don't sit on the right side of the church, was what I remember being told. That was the "Anglo side" of the church. I was hispanic and therefore had to sit on the left side. Although i did not know of Atheism at that time, nobody said I had a choice.
I attended Catechism like everyone I knew and became an Alter Boy til the age of 18.
My first encouter with atheism was when my college Philosophy professor was asked by a student in the class if he believed in God. He said no and the majority of the class seemed to lose respect for him after that. That was shameful because he was a great Professor.
To this day I have never met an Atheist or Agnostic.
In many instances it would take counter brainwashing to undo the engrained societal brainwashing that believers practice on each other. But if a person truly examines the evidence (or lack of) he would come to this conclusion.
There is no proof of a Supreme Being and never has been. He either doesn't exist or chooses to stay hidden. Either of which would contradict the rest of the stories.
CONCLUSION: GOD is a myth. And his followers are Make-Believers.

With all due respect to you Grandmother, nobody in the Catholic Church ever told anyone, the left and right side of the church would have been for some racial reasons. Maybe it had to do with how an older hispanic culture recieved Communion? Placing on the tounge not in the hands.

A question Atheists refuse to answer is "What would you consider proof?" Something in your life swayed you for some reason.

This is the dumbest topic I've ever seen.

What the hell are we going to "brainwash" them with? Science, facts, and logic?

I shutter to think you have offspring to screw up too. Your buddy bailed on you while you were gone!

What are you "shutting"? You need to shut your mouth.

I shudder to think how your son would have turned out...had he been raised while in the current senile state you're in.