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Army Releases November Suicide Data

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Postby ricardo » Sat Jun 09, 2012 12:41 am

source DOD suicides up 18 / 20 % from 2011 tragic subject ( killing ones self)
needs more investigation and intervention. there has to be commonalities that
can be identified ,linked to cause /effect , and resolved.

I'm curious if resources from outside DOD can be utilized to 'independently' come up w/ working solutions for soldier wellness .

the military practices social Darwinism . by the necessity and nature of war. even if cause and effect that results in non combat hostile deaths,the reason
for these deaths may be environments external the soldier ?

maybe the focus should be on events and reasoning or causes independent the victims .( soldiers )life on bases isolated from the ' normal ' societal stresses ' be a factor ?bases are a world unto themselves . a reverse anomie comes to mind, once decompressed from military life.

conversely, the roles , rules, regulations ,in the military have nothing in common w / real world (reality) like distributeds socialization and morals , group think. it's factual not adverse society, and a necessary component of nations... opinions only.

in other words jack, it ain't the soldiers fault. maybe team leaders know something , would love to know their views. threat of banishment from the
military culture may not be the ultimate solution.
Last edited by ricardo on Thu Jun 14, 2012 7:29 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby greeney2 » Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:54 am

There is another side of the military suicide rate, and that is homocide rate. There are many instances where someone came home, and killed a spouse. I think the army was studying a pattern of 101 st airborne units, that had quite a few murders.

There are many distinct differences from these middle east wars and other wars. WW2 men were drafted or enlisted, and the country was united in the cause, as a declared war after Pearl Harbor. Korea was a police action. Viet Nam was another policing action that escalated, so we drafted mostly 19 year olds, and they knew there was an end to there time served. Not that they didn't have severe phycological impact, it was different. These middle east wars not only are long, but most are called up reservists, who were not kids out of high school, they were established people with homes, jobs, and families. Bad enough they are expected to fight for their lives, but we ask them to return again and again, with no end in sight. They are stressed out, hated, and have families and homes, upside down facing forclosures due to income dropping, and all kinds of home hardships. In other wars, your only connection to home was handwritten letters, but now everyday they can call home with SKYPE cameras, see each other, and talk to each other, which probably makes it 10 times harder.

Its no wonder so many reach the brink of not taking it anymore. Our polititons all know that bringing back the draft would be political suicide, so we just keep asking our all volunteer army to keep doing this thankless deed, while the rest of the world just goes on with life. Kiss the ground they walk on all you young people, becasue what we ask of them is out of balance for a country. You can not expect only one group to continually stay in combat, and never expect anyone else to serve in the military. As unfair as Viet Nam was in my era, if you got drafted you knew it would be for 2 years. These guys just finished in Iraq, and got rewarded by being sent to Afganistan for more. No wonder they have a high suicide rate.
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Postby ricardo » Sat Jun 09, 2012 12:50 pm

I agree with contrasts g-2. Id like to add, women were undergoing paradigm
shifts in social self awareness as well . additional family pressures from once traditional roles, morphing.

recruits - all wars had massive deferments, and exemptions.? undue burden
of repetitive tours, not sure about contributing factor. draft or not.
no wars and environmental factors are the same. but, social problems persist.
perhaps war has become so unpopular drones are making up for the diminishing
returns... " popular support argument "

now we are learning as you point out , ' popular support ' ] is 'not' needed to
initiate / conduct war. how do you feel g- 2 if we go to war w/ entire
divisions of mercenary soldiers ? training and rotating out of theaters , (only
to monitor , and measure results) . the indigenous populations ( behind the slipping mask of winning the hearts and minds)

do you know g-2 for all the shifts in traditional family roles , if women were required by law to register for the draft.? when applying for voter I'd or a drivers license. if not why not ? coincidentally , that would put a nail in the coffin of the = pay for = work arguement . proponent for] supreme court should remedy this .

that would be one argument against = pay for = work ...or are we specialized ,
to define this as equal pay for equal oppourtunity ?

studies of enemy suicide( rates) causality might add to a solution. one obscure
study noted beneficial neuroprotective effects of marijuana use in post traumatic stress victims. this leads me to speculate rampant pot use during nam was beneficial . ( questionable)

nevertheless , I venture the balance of the psychological cost of war, is in need of correction , but not in terms of social standing - protected status , we progressed beyond this terminology, and in doing so we can not negate women, bearing shared responsibility in the totality of war. from voting on such matters and being a full/ complete member of society is the ultimate sacrifice for our country.
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Postby Cole_Trickle » Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:35 am

The real reason the rates are so high is not being told, that info gets suppressed, it always will.

Many men and women in the Military are conflicted, their conscience eats away at them until they break. I think it's borderline criminal, I always will.

My opinion, and only my opinion, is that they are not certain that the war they are bogged down in is a just one. Many high ranked soldiers have spoken out about this very thing.

It's like Viet-Nam, only worse, if that can ever do it justice.

No wonder many feel lost and beyond hope. So sad.

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Postby greeney2 » Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:13 am

I'm sure that is also one reason, but I also think becasue of modern day technology of being able to be out on a detail, killing someone one minute, and coming in to a computer that you can call home, see your family in real time, only makes if worse. Even in Viet Nam time or any other war, you were plucked out of your life and isolated, with long waits between sending and recieving mail, or even having time to write that letter. In most other wars, young guys usually, were drafted at times when they had nothing better to do but play, but this generation of people were established in life with families, occupations, and homes. Many are also dealing with home financial problems, forclosures, and a wife left along to deal with the family problems. In some cases the Mother was recalled, and Dad is home.

Lets face it, these poor people have a thankless task at this point. We are seeing all kinds of horrific injuries returning, where in Viet Nam we didn't have the ability to save these lives, if they lost a limb, most of them died in the field. The PTS seems to be universal that all wars have it to a severe degree, and universally the government doesn't treat it very well. Even WW2 lasted 3 1/2 years in the Pacific, adn a little longer in length in Europe, these guys are near 10 years with no end in sight.
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