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Postby khanster » Sun Apr 08, 2012 1:24 pm

at1with0 wrote:Really? Did the voices in your head tell you that?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subjective_idealism

But we can establish without doubt that perception is a mathematical object and then prove it mathematically...

http://www.math.csusb.edu/notes/proofs/pfnot/node8.html

Existence Proofs

Theorems which state ``There exists an x such that conclusion'' are known as existence theorems. Many, but not all, theorems of this type are proved using a constructive proof so named because one finds an element x that does satisfy the conclusion. As a simple example consider the statement ``Let a be a real number. There exists a real number x that is a solution to the equation 5x+3 = a''. A proof of this statement would construct such a real number x. Using the rules of arithmetic in the real number system, we know that if a is a real number then so too is (a-3)/5. This is a value of x that is a solution to the equation since 5x +3 = 5(a-3)/5 + 3 = a -3 +3 = a as required. Of course not all proofs are this simple and to produce an element x that will work may require ingenuity.
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Postby at1with0 » Sun Apr 08, 2012 3:49 pm

Maybe I should have said that testimony about perception isn't proof.
"it is easy to grow crazy"
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Postby khanster » Sun Apr 08, 2012 3:53 pm

at1with0 wrote:Maybe I should have said that testimony about perception isn't proof.


Proof of proof is proof of perception
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Postby DIss0n80r » Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:27 pm

Consensus perception is generally perceived as objective validation.
"I can conceive of nothing in religion, science, or philosophy, that is anything more than the proper thing to wear, for a while." ~ Charles Fort
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Postby at1with0 » Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:37 pm

Yes.

Makes it hard to prove that the voice in my head are REAL DAMMIT
"it is easy to grow crazy"
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Postby DIss0n80r » Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:16 am

There appears to be an implicit invalidation of individual experience in the consensus worldview, yes. Purportedly to ensure stricter reality-affirming communicative modalities yet I still observe my fellow apes often discussing what their preferred invisible entity's expectations and motivations are, not to mention the common ritual of clasping hands to telepathically communicate with it. :pray:
"I can conceive of nothing in religion, science, or philosophy, that is anything more than the proper thing to wear, for a while." ~ Charles Fort
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Postby khanster » Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:59 am

Consensus works in a limited way, until the consensus model is falsified and a new model must be created.
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Postby DIss0n80r » Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:08 pm

Sooner or later, consensus usually becomes an impediment to truth.
"I can conceive of nothing in religion, science, or philosophy, that is anything more than the proper thing to wear, for a while." ~ Charles Fort
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Postby at1with0 » Thu Apr 26, 2012 3:45 pm

Awaken to a light of knowing
all your truth was lies
and the faith which you embraced
has left you blind
deceived like the fools that surround you
it came with ease unfulfilled were the days of your being
but now you will see

-Steve Tucker
"it is easy to grow crazy"
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Postby DIss0n80r » Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:09 pm

Image
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