The Black Vault

Absolutely despicable. I see articles like this all the time, from sources that cover atrocities taking place against people from all faiths. If only tolerance could be taught by organized religion, even in new ministries being set up in Pagan areas. You know, maybe these people wouldn't continue to be burned alive in front of their children because of clergy, using doctrine intermingled with local superstitions, to demonize Paganism. Paganism being an umbrella term, naturally. Yep, Christians are the only people being ostracized, their freedoms trampled upon.

One group goes about ostracizing them with brute force as well as anyone else different. The second group uses it's cleverly disquised politics to encite others to use brute force. The third group uses brute force on the first while using the second group's own political system to receive help doing it. Pagans be damned either way. They can have their religious freedom until they are discovered, then the NIMBY lynch mob is deployed. After all, everything is their fault anyway. Nope, nothing similar about these groups at all.

It's no surprise to see pot shots taken at Constitutionalists and Libertarians, considering the dogma subscribed to. Freedom of religion and speech has always been a thorn in the side of the religion of politics. Be sure to watch the newest episode of sitcom x, check the latest footage from the laser-guided-bunker-busting-terrorist-killing-bomb-o-rama site, consume, support the war, glory to the state! Brought to you by your preferred slant of the MSM. Keep drinking the kool-aid.

Truth be told, Pagans don't want to convert or sacrifice your children. They want to be able to send their children, to the state run public school we all pay for, without having them bullied and ostracized by the faculty and other students because of their beliefs. To attend school functions as a family without the political and religious BS. To assemble in public places, again places we all pay for, without facing this same situation. The truth though, that's what's dangerous. The truth is that organized religion is the one on the attack. They aren't falling apart from without because the "evil Pagans" are corrupting their congregations.

No, these religions are being exposed for what they are. Political entities bent on subjugation and control through fear management and nothing more. For so-called religions of peace, they sure do preach a lot of hate and intolerance. All while standing on a morally superior soap-box and talking about the other guy. Amazing. Oh but Jesus says- yeah but which one? Your Jesus, the Catholic Jesus, the Baptist Jesus, the Pentacostal Jesus, the Mormon Jesus, etc, etc, etc. My Jesus said this, oh yeah well my Jesus said that. Ok, so you guys aren't very organized. I know, let's go out and preach it anyway!

greeney2 wrote: This is not a few here and there, it is the law of the land in all muslim countries, plus ...

Really. That's just plain false.

hxxx wrote:

greeney2 wrote: This is not a few here and there, it is the law of the land in all muslim countries, plus ...

Really. That's just plain false.

I'll tell you what is "just plain false."

It's your attempt at derailing the thread into a "Christians are bad people" thread by claiming that just because someone denounces a death sentence pronounced against someone for not converting to Islam, they are a "Xian" on their "high horse."

Oh ok. Would you rather I applaud the death sentence? Apparently.

Oh, but then you would have condemned me as a pro-murder Christian. So, you see? A Christian can't win with you no matter WHAT we say. I think the message you are trying to get across is, Christians best just shut up around here or you will find a way to twist whatever they say into something negative and condemn them for it. The problem then, which is obvious, lies within you.

at1with0 wrote:Am I the only one here who sees the glaring contradiction?

If you don't convert to Christianity, you are sentenced to hell by God, which is far more severe a punishment than issued by any Islamic regime.

So now what can you say?

There is no contradiction because Christianity teaches that we love our neighbor, not slit their throat for not converting. Christianity teaches that when someone is not Christian, they should be enlightened to the Gospel and treated as potential family members, not targets to be stoned to death. Christianity teaches that judgment day is after death on this Earth and Christ will be the judge.. not us. For we don't know for sure what is true in ANY other person's heart and mind. Therefore we don't know who is truly of the the faith and who isn't. Therefore we are not in a position to judge anyone on matters of the faith. Islam obviously teaches otherwise. Islam evidently teaches that just some words from a man's lips are the deciding factor on whether he is embraced, or murdered. Islam evidently teaches that the ultimate judge is a court of bearded, bigoted men. All the guy had to do is say he rejects Christ and embraces Islam, and they would have set him free. They are the judges of Islam, not their god.

Christians martyr themslves by not renouncing their faith in Christ, even if it means being put to death for it. Muslims martyr themselves by strapping on explosives (or boarding jumbo jets) and taking as many innocent lives with them as they can, when they kill themselves.

The vast differences between Islam and Christianity are myriad, at1. No contradiction.

Rykuss wrote:Absolutely despicable. I see articles like this all the time, from sources that cover atrocities taking place against people from all faiths. If only tolerance could be taught by organized religion, even in new ministries being set up in Pagan areas. You know, maybe these people wouldn't continue to be burned alive in front of their children because of clergy, using doctrine intermingled with local superstitions, to demonize Paganism. Paganism being an umbrella term, naturally. Yep, Christians are the only people being ostracized, their freedoms trampled upon.

One group goes about ostracizing them with brute force as well as anyone else different. The second group uses it's cleverly disquised politics to encite others to use brute force. The third group uses brute force on the first while using the second group's own political system to receive help doing it. Pagans be damned either way. They can have their religious freedom until they are discovered, then the NIMBY lynch mob is deployed. After all, everything is their fault anyway. Nope, nothing similar about these groups at all.

It's no surprise to see pot shots taken at Constitutionalists and Libertarians, considering the dogma subscribed to. Freedom of religion and speech has always been a thorn in the side of the religion of politics. Be sure to watch the newest episode of sitcom x, check the latest footage from the laser-guided-bunker-busting-terrorist-killing-bomb-o-rama site, consume, support the war, glory to the state! Brought to you by your preferred slant of the MSM. Keep drinking the kool-aid.

Truth be told, Pagans don't want to convert or sacrifice your children. They want to be able to send their children, to the state run public school we all pay for, without having them bullied and ostracized by the faculty and other students because of their beliefs. To attend school functions as a family without the political and religious BS. To assemble in public places, again places we all pay for, without facing this same situation. The truth though, that's what's dangerous. The truth is that organized religion is the one on the attack. They aren't falling apart from without because the "evil Pagans" are corrupting their congregations.

No, these religions are being exposed for what they are. Political entities bent on subjugation and control through fear management and nothing more. For so-called religions of peace, they sure do preach a lot of hate and intolerance. All while standing on a morally superior soap-box and talking about the other guy. Amazing. Oh but Jesus says- yeah but which one? Your Jesus, the Catholic Jesus, the Baptist Jesus, the Pentacostal Jesus, the Mormon Jesus, etc, etc, etc. My Jesus said this, oh yeah well my Jesus said that. Ok, so you guys aren't very organized. I know, let's go out and preach it anyway!

Interesting rant, and I get it, but, what does this have to do with a Christian Pastor who is so sure of his faith and so confident in Christ, he is willing to die for it? Such conviction should be applauded, not diluted and diminished, with the message being changed into "Poor Christians, why don't you just shut up and quit teaching your ways, others are being persecuted too."

We know that others are being persecuted and you are perfectly within your rights to post all the articles you want about those persecutions. But how dare you condemn the entire Christian Church Body because a wrong is being brought to public attention. Nowhere in the article, in fact nowhere in this thread, is there a claim that Christians are the only ones being persecuted. Nowhere does it say Christians are all perfect, or Christians don't overzealously judge others and persecute others in our own ways. We all know these things are true, but, is this posted article only worthy, if we put a disclaimer at the bottom that says,"However, we do understand that Christians are just as mean and nasty as everyone else, so, this story isn't really all that relevant."

hxxx wrote:
I'll state clearly that it's my understanding that Islam does proscribe the death penalty for apostasy. I think that's totally wrong and one of the f'ed up things about Islam. Given that there are ~1,500,000,000+ muslims in the world and one would have to dig to find a dozen examples where the penalty was proscribed and carried out...

That said, get off your high horse Xians. Y'all set a pretty shitty example.

Stories like this seem to be broadcast to inflame and further misunderstanding. Lookit those crazy muslims! (you know, that very small minority of them!) They're ALL like that. ... based on the actions of the few.

I don't get it. Why people don't poeple foster understanding? Why don't they notice and point out that the similarities between Islam and Christianity are much much more bountiful than the differences. Alas, they are two different fairy tales...

Probably too much profit to be made off the conflict. Divide and conquer

Interesting little rant against Christians. Only interesting though since the article comes from a secular news source. And, no digging would be necessary to find other reports like this. You can find them every day of the week, not just from western sources either. You find them in the "official" Islamic news sources in countries under Sharia law.

And it is far from being just a few nut cases out of the millions of Muslims in the world. The stories of atrocities committed under Sharia law are reported daily. Where is the outcry from Muslims who think this kind of action is wrong? Where is any Muslim protesting the extreme behavior of the "few bad Muslims"? You wont find them.

There are no similarities between Christianity and Islam. The two religions are polar opposites. The major tenant of Christianity is love your neighbor, and your enemy also. The major tenant of Islam is subdue your neighbor, make him convert or die.

hxxx, no one here buys your BS about how wonderful Islam is. Not when we can look at our daily news and see otherwise. You are either totally clueless about the religion you claim to have been born in, or you are a professional liar. I don't believe you are clueless.

Let's try this again.

What happens to someone who never converts to Christianity, like, after they die?

frrostedman wrote:

Rykuss wrote:Absolutely despicable. I see articles like this all the time, from sources that cover atrocities taking place against people from all faiths. If only tolerance could be taught by organized religion, even in new ministries being set up in Pagan areas. You know, maybe these people wouldn't continue to be burned alive in front of their children because of clergy, using doctrine intermingled with local superstitions, to demonize Paganism. Paganism being an umbrella term, naturally. Yep, Christians are the only people being ostracized, their freedoms trampled upon.

One group goes about ostracizing them with brute force as well as anyone else different. The second group uses it's cleverly disquised politics to encite others to use brute force. The third group uses brute force on the first while using the second group's own political system to receive help doing it. Pagans be damned either way. They can have their religious freedom until they are discovered, then the NIMBY lynch mob is deployed. After all, everything is their fault anyway. Nope, nothing similar about these groups at all.

It's no surprise to see pot shots taken at Constitutionalists and Libertarians, considering the dogma subscribed to. Freedom of religion and speech has always been a thorn in the side of the religion of politics. Be sure to watch the newest episode of sitcom x, check the latest footage from the laser-guided-bunker-busting-terrorist-killing-bomb-o-rama site, consume, support the war, glory to the state! Brought to you by your preferred slant of the MSM. Keep drinking the kool-aid.

Truth be told, Pagans don't want to convert or sacrifice your children. They want to be able to send their children, to the state run public school we all pay for, without having them bullied and ostracized by the faculty and other students because of their beliefs. To attend school functions as a family without the political and religious BS. To assemble in public places, again places we all pay for, without facing this same situation. The truth though, that's what's dangerous. The truth is that organized religion is the one on the attack. They aren't falling apart from without because the "evil Pagans" are corrupting their congregations.

No, these religions are being exposed for what they are. Political entities bent on subjugation and control through fear management and nothing more. For so-called religions of peace, they sure do preach a lot of hate and intolerance. All while standing on a morally superior soap-box and talking about the other guy. Amazing. Oh but Jesus says- yeah but which one? Your Jesus, the Catholic Jesus, the Baptist Jesus, the Pentacostal Jesus, the Mormon Jesus, etc, etc, etc. My Jesus said this, oh yeah well my Jesus said that. Ok, so you guys aren't very organized. I know, let's go out and preach it anyway!

Interesting rant, and I get it, but, what does this have to do with a Christian Pastor who is so sure of his faith and so confident in Christ, he is willing to die for it? Such conviction should be applauded, not diluted and diminished, with the message being changed into "Poor Christians, why don't you just shut up and quit teaching your ways, others are being persecuted too."

We know that others are being persecuted and you are perfectly within your rights to post all the articles you want about those persecutions. But how dare you condemn the entire Christian Church Body because a wrong is being brought to public attention. Nowhere in the article, in fact nowhere in this thread, is there a claim that Christians are the only ones being persecuted. Nowhere does it say Christians are all perfect, or Christians don't overzealously judge others and persecute others in our own ways. We all know these things are true, but, is this posted article only worthy, if we put a disclaimer at the bottom that says,"However, we do understand that Christians are just as mean and nasty as everyone else, so, this story isn't really all that relevant."

Exactly the response I expected. Perhaps you shouldn't rant and call people with different views terrorists or sympathizers if you aren't prepared to be called out on the hypocrisy of your faith. You see, this particular Pastor is a human being because he's Christian. The Pagans and Muslims are "terrorists" and "heathens", which totally makes it alright to bomb the hell out of their cities or burn them alive. It's also what makes it alright to ostracize school children because they and their parents aren't "right with God". Right here in America, land of the free. This is why the religion of politics doesn't like the constitution of our great nation. All these silly Muslim terrorist sympathizers and their delusions of freedom of religion and free speech.

Arrogant, bigotted and paranoid. Nope, nothing judgemental about that attitude at all. Get enough of you together, be it in a forum such as this or in a public school and the $cientologist lynch mob mentality comes out every single time. They took a leaf out of the Judeo Christian book and started using the legal system to go after their enemies as well. Harrass, bully, whatever it takes. Sure, the evil Atheists and Pagans fought back and got the courts to uphold the constitution(after sueing) but never fear! The good guys are trying to sneak the good ole boy stuff back in.

The usual suspects must swoop in and stamp out dissent, discussion is only open when it fits your views. I see you've joined their ranks, not surprising based on our interactions. I figured something was up when I came back to see that hardly anyone posts here and now I know why. Enjoy the Christian Vault folks. I've had my fill and there's only so many youtube videos a guy can link to. Unfortunately, that's the most entertaining thing one can do around here anymore. All this religious talk is too easy to predict, much like it's followers.

As drive by posts go, that was pretty weak, Guest.

Dear guest -

*sigh*

This thread is about how it is wrong for ANY government power to put a death sentence on someone for their religious beliefs. This thread is also about how a true Christian, when faced with a death threat, will stick by his convictions and refuse to renounce faith in Christ.

Any OTHER bs you want to talk about, i.e. what a*holes and hypocrites Christians are, is fine, just crank up a thread or add to the several dozen that already exist on that subject. But it is inappropriate to derail this thread and use it as a forum to grind your axe.

The only questions this thread poses to you is, do you agree with what the Iran leadership decided in this case, and if you were the Pastor would you recant to save your life?

Please try to stick to the subject, or, alternatively, start up a different thread if you would rather discuss a different subject. In this particular thread, I'm not inclined to defend the Crusades, the Salem witch trials, abortion clinic bombers, godhatesfags.com, the KKK, or whatever other scenario or group of people you want to cite as evidence for your view that Christians are a*holes and hypocrites. That's not what this thread is about.

Funny that you stoop so low as to suggest that the Iranians that pronounced the death sentence are on equal moral footing with the Christian they sentenced to death. Using YOUR logic then, if a group of Christians murdered an innocent, defenseless man for praying to Allah, they are just as righteous and good as he is. Is that what you believe? Somehow I doubt it, but, you should answer the question for all to see.

Well said, FM.