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TNuke
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 Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 7:32 am Post subject: Frontline: Heat |
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Frontline, "Heat" on PBS Tonight
Watch at your own risk.
Preview:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/story/2008/10/heat.html
Quote: "Re-inventing the engine of our civilization"
Sounds good but how do we do that? The very changes in politics that are going on now will prevent this from happening. Who would risk their money to attempt to create new technology when they know the government will just come and steal it?
They want you to believe that energy itself is the problem and that your access to it needs to be massively curtailed. Whether its your car or your house, they want your energy usage to be severely decreased, and NOW, almost like its some kind of emergency. They must think that there is a giant asteroid heading towards the Earth, or something of similar magnitude. What are they not telling us?
The preview mentions CO2 like its Satan. Guess what, every time you take a breath you are creating CO2. Plants absorb CO2 and create Oxygen. One could argue that we should be planting more trees. I’ll go along with that. Everybody likes trees.
"We're standing at the precipice of hell." A bit alarmist, ya think?
"The western model of growth is inherently toxic." And yet, after 140 years of development since the industrial revolution, we are still here. I seem to be dealing with the toxic model pretty good so far.
“India will become the most populated country in the world by 2030.” Sounds like they need a condom factory.
Concrete, being as old as ancient Rome, is an old technology. One could argue that we should have found a better building material by now.
All boils down to you having to be removed from your house. They identified "fossil fuels" as the ultimate enemy many years ago and they want to end its use, entirely. They do not care that it will spark a world wide depression the likes of the Great Depression in the 1930's. Expect pain, expect Fascism, expect War.
What's worse is that this same global warming crowd rejects any existing viable technology to replace "fossil fuels", like nuclear. Instead they promote these stupid windmills that aren't even economically viable and are a blight on the landscape, or bio-fuels that do nothing but move the costs to the food industry. They don't seem to want the problem fixed.
Earth is a great planet except there is all these people running around on it. |
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TNuke
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| Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:14 am Post subject: |
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As I suspected, it was a lot of hogwash. Too many wrong things to mention.
But, Exxon Mobil not looking too good right now. They handled this badly. Lesson learned: When they come to ask you about the environment you better have a good answer and it better not be smoke and mirrors. And when you are called before congress to answer questions about the environment you better not just sit there with a "I'm gonna kill you" look on your face. That's not gonna work man. These guys need a plan.
Having said that... What a STUPID IDIOTIC question it is, "Why aren't you developing new energy sources, like bio-fuels?" Hey MORON, ITS AN OIL COMPANY!!! They are in business to supply OIL!
Companies do not exist to serve the needs of the people. They exist to make a profit. You want community service then go ahead and do it. Start a non-profit organization or get government to sponsor research or GOD FORBID put YOUR money where your mouth is and start a company selling alternative energy. Holy cow, what an idea! |
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TNuke
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| Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 7:10 am Post subject: |
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Nobody ever responded to this and I have to wonder why. I thought the whole Global Warming thing was a popular topic. Still lots of YouTube vids on it.
The biggest problem is telling people the "right" thing to do. They talk about course of action, ok, well what is the right course of action? You want to know why the Global Warming topic is falling off the table? Because when certain political ideologists realize that the topic isn't helping them politically as much as they thought it would or it no longer serves their purpose, it makes no sense to support it.
So, if we really do have a global climate change problem, it is now guaranteed that we will not fix it. Side A stopped pushing it and Side B never cared in the first place. Nobody wants to give up their luxuries. Science still hasn't shown conclusively that humans have anything to do with it or how we can fix it. Not enough details are given, only simplified generalities. Not convincing enough for people to act.
One old adage still applies. You cannot conserve your way to prosperity. You must produce in order to prosper. And for global climate change we need to produce a better energy source, not legislate companies out of business. Destroying the world's economy will guarantee our inability to deal with this issue, and any other issue. |
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TNuke
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| Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 8:01 am Post subject: |
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Sorry, one more thing. If you look at A Gore's CO2 charts they are misleading. The actual evidence shows that CO2 follows temperature change, not leads it. And that makes sense. When Temperature goes up there are more forest fires, which decrease vegetation. Less vegetation more CO2. Why? Because animal respiration converts O2 into CO2 and vegetation converts CO2 into O2. The temperature change to warmer climate increases population of animals and cold temps decrease animal population and the reverse is true for plants. Plus, animals eat vegetation, so that adds to the inverse relationship. The balance between O2 and CO2 is dependent upon the ratio of animals to plants which is dependent upon temperature.
So plant more trees. Oh, but that won't get certain politicians elected will it. |
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TNuke
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| Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 9:14 am Post subject: |
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And then we have this...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2T4UF_Rmlio&feature=related
Folks, this is a seminar at the University of California, San Diego. These are supposed to be intelligent people! This entire hour long rant contains not one shred of evidence of climate change. Not one! It is nothing but regurgitating the opinions of people who are themselves regurgitating opinions of other people. She even inadvertently admits this at one point. No scientific evidence what-so-ever is presented. Notice how she repeatedly ties all of it to politics, hint hint.
She even presents old, very old (1930's), information that was many years ago proven wrong. Matters not, since everything she presents is nothing but pure opinion, based on political ideology. I'm surprised she didn't come right out and say, "Republicanism causes global warming."
"Strong minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Weak minds discuss people." And this seminar is the perfect example of the latter.
The seminar even degenerates into nothing but poll results and bashing people who oppose the conclusions of global warming. It completely leaves the entire topic of climate change and goes on and on about cigarette smoking. Unbelievable! What a complete joke. This is what our colleges are teaching? I'd rather have my kids smoking dope than listening to this crap.
Oh and last but not least, she isn't even a scientist at all. She's a historian. Why is the University of California presenting what is supposed to be scientific material using historians??? Does UCSD not actually have any scientists? |
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TNuke
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| Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 4:44 am Post subject: |
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From Wikipedia:
"Fascism opposes international socialism, communism, conservatism, democracy, individualism, liberalism, materialism, pacifism, laissez faire, and political pluralism."
Well, much of that certainly applies to the lecturer in the video. In fact she comes right out and identifies "laissez faire" as her target. |
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SRO
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| Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 6:30 am Post subject: |
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Oh, I didn't even see this thread, goes to show I should scroll down and visit all of the forums eh?
Thanks for the read TNuke, I've long been of the opinion that climate change isn't primarily effected by human beings, and that we don't have the means to confirm otherwise.
Have you seen "An inconvenient Truth" ( ) What a political piece of work eh? Non scientists pretending to be scientists to convert the masses (who are apparently unable to research and find out who is actually a politician versus a scientist)
Who was it that said something along the lines of:
"It is not my faith that scientists are correct, that leads me to believe them, but my faith that the non-scientists are wrong."? |
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TNuke
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| Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 11:46 am Post subject: |
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I have heard of that movie but I tend to steer clear of any Michael Moore type horse manure. Moore peaked with Canadian Bacon.
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that the whole global climate change thing is nothing more than a political movement disguised as a natural disaster. Try to find actual science that backs up their claims and well good luck with that research. And to make matters worse many of these global climate change promoters appear to be using (distorting) Humanist philosophy.
If these people really had evidence of GW you would think they would be happy to show it to you. Instead, they are evasive. |
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SRO
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| Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Preeetty much. I mean, it's real, but as far as our involvement in it, so far that is entirely political, there is no science supporting it. Lots of people with lots of degrees in science offering their opinion but no actual scientific method tested science. |
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mr_headshot
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| Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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At any rate, be it caused by humans or not, something still needs to be done to at least try and help the environment. I don't really think we're the main cause (if we're one at all). The warming is probably a natural clensing cycle as seen in the past.
But it can't hurt to try and help out the earth by planting more trees and killing fewer animals, putting less toxins in the water and the air. Global warming or not, that sh*t is bad for us. |
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SRO
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| Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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Yes absolutely! I'm all for keeping the environment clean and doing our part in the way of maintaining the planet.  |
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fortwynt
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| Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 7:27 pm Post subject: |
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I concur with that.
I mean, its funny really...most of my christian conservative friends (as well as my father) all seem to believe that global warming is bunk and all invented for a variety of political reasons....
I tend to argue that global warming may be real, but if it is is PROBABLY more the result of the natural warming and cooling of earth NATURALLY....i mean...coming out of an ice age the earth is "warming" in areas and such and this before man made C02...but then again i dont think even then it would be a bad idea to clean up the earth as much as possible.
what i find truly alarming are those folks who are conservative christians have the least amount of worry over "environmental issues", because i think for one they see this as a purely liberal movement a.k.a. anti christian...yet i would think that if one worships God, a.k.a. the creator of the universe and EARTH specifically they would be more inclined to protect it....
*shrugs*
its, if nothing else, an interesting study in psychology. |
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TNuke
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| Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2008 2:13 am Post subject: |
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| fortwynt wrote: |
| I mean, its funny really...most of my christian conservative friends (as well as my father) all seem to believe that global warming is bunk and all invented for a variety of political reasons.... |
And why do you think that is? Did you watch the video? The global warming promoters have turned it into a political movement headed by a politician. Have you not been paying attention? It is the Left who has turned this into a Left Wing Cause and its run by anti-capitalists. Conservatives are rational people that expect wild claims to be backed up by that little thing called evidence.
| fortwynt wrote: |
| I tend to argue that global warming may be real, ...i dont think even then it would be a bad idea to clean up the earth as much as possible. |
Because you are missing the basic laws of physics. Do you know what percentage of the earth's land is occupied by humans? Do you know what percentage of the earth's atmospheric volume humans occupy? Both are miniscule. Even if you removed every human it would not significantly effect the climate.
| fortwynt wrote: |
| what i find truly alarming are those folks who are conservative christians have the least amount of worry over "environmental issues", because i think for one they see this as a purely liberal movement a.k.a. anti christian...yet i would think that if one worships God, a.k.a. the creator of the universe and EARTH specifically they would be more inclined to protect it.... |
That's because they put humans before political ideology or unsubstantiated claims of disaster. What I find truly alarming is people presenting a conclusion as if they were scientists when they are not. And the big and most important question of all continues to be unanswered, why is this information not being presented by scientists?
The dirty little secret is that the anti-capitalist left wing movement has been corrupting our education system for a long time and they have worked their way into the universities and have now corrupted science itself. One of the primary tactics of socialists is to get you to stop believing any and all experts. And scientists, real scientists, are experts. So the movement subverts their opinion and replaces it with their own, which they know is false, and then presents it as if it were the opinion of the scientists. It works with doctors, lawyers, engineers, pilots, industrialists, anyone with a college degree or an expertise of any kind. They must all be subverted. Hell, that's what Lenin did. Once he gained power the first thing he did was shoot every member of the intelligencia. And that, or something equivalent, is what will happen to the remaining few real scientists once these socialists gain complete control.
Did you not hear the left wing leaders publicly state, "any college professor or scientist who does not support the idea of global climate change will be fired"? Were you on vacation?
Global Climate Change is a political movement. |
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Nesaie
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| Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2008 8:47 am Post subject: |
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In the 60's the scientists were warning about global cooling. Now, it's global warming. 
Apparently, mars is getting warmer too. Is that man's fault?
I don't understand why this scare tactic is used. I totally agree that we should take care of the environment around us and not pollute, but why consentrate on global warming? Is it to sell biodiesel? Is there some corporation with strong political ties that benefits from this? |
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fortwynt
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| Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2008 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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not at all TNUKE, I myself don't believe Global Warming is caused by humans, or human waste specifically....however I do believe in Global Warming as a logical concept...in fact, it is an undeniable event throughout the history of Earth....one that has very little, if anything, to do with the ozone layer....also something that we couldn't control even if we threw every dollar, and every piece of tech at.
I find it a strange thing that you say the goal is to garner public distrust in established science/scientists....it was my understanding that conservative christians were the ones generally going against science and distrusting it....two sides of the same coin perhaps? |
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