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icewhale
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Joined: Jul 20, 2004
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 Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 12:29 am Post subject: Russia and Georgia Go To War |
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Oh b*gg*r. 
Georgia 'downs two Russian warplanes' as countries move to brink of war
From Times OnlineAugust 8, 2008
Georgia claimed today to have downed two Russian warplanes over its territory after the former Soviet neighbours came into direct conflict over the breakaway province of South Ossetia.
Tbilisi mobilised its army reserves and launched a major military offensive overnight to regain control over the province, raising fears of an all-out war that could draw in Russia.
Moscow backs the separatists, most of whom are Russian citizens, and has its own "peackeepers" in South Ossetia.
Fighting raged around the city of Tskhinvali, the South Ossetian capital, as Georgian troops backed by tanks and warplanes pounded separatist forces today. At least 15 people were reported to have been killed although the death toll was expected to rise.
Full article
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Georgia says Russian tanks mean 'war' in South Ossetia
From Times OnlineAugust 8, 2008
Russia sent troops and dozens of tanks into the breakaway Georgian province of South Ossetia today, throwing the two former Soviet neighbours into a sudden yet undeclared state of war.
In the most serious regional crisis since the collapse of the Soviets in 1991, at least 50 tanks – and possibly many more – rumbled through the Roki tunnel, which cuts through the Caucasus mountains separating South Ossetia from the Russian province of North Ossetia.
"One hundred and fifty Russian tanks, armoured personnel carriers and other vehicles have entered South Ossetia,” President Saakashvili of Georgia told reporters in Tbilisi. “This is a clear intrusion on another country’s territory. We have Russian tanks on our territory, jets on our territory in broad daylight."
Full article
icewhale |
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shadowfx
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Joined: Oct 08, 2001
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 2:42 am Post subject: |
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Narrator: "Sh*t meet fan"
Sh*t: "Hello Fan"
Fan: "hello Sh*T" |
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icewhale
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 3:31 am Post subject: |
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Has it dawned on many people over on your side of the pond, shadowfx, just how involved they might become in all of this?
icewhale |
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shadowfx
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 4:53 am Post subject: |
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I don't think it has really sunk in to many at all.
Most people (the ones that even know about it) figure it's nothing big.
It is always something big when the big Russian Bear is woke up though. |
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greeney2
B.V. Info-a-holic
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Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:56 am Post subject: |
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I think you are going to see the difference between Russian bombers, and the United States Stealth bombers and lazer/gps guided bombs, judging from the death toll and the fact they shot down 2 bombers.
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Georgia reports new air attacks at military bases By MUSA SADULAYEV, Associated Press Writer
1 hour, 21 minutes ago
DZHAVA, Georgia - Russia dispatched an armored column into the breakaway enclave of South Ossetia on Friday after Georgia, a staunch U.S. ally, launched a surprise offensive to crush separatists. Witnesses said hundreds of civilians were killed. Fighting reportedly raged well into the night with Georgia's interior ministry saying early Saturday that warplanes attacked three Georgian military bases and key facilities for shipping oil to the West.
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The fighting, which devastated the capital of Tskhinvali, threatened to ignite a wider war between Georgia and Russia, and escalate tensions between Moscow and Washington. Georgia said it was forced to launch the assault because of rebel attacks; the separatists alleged Georgia violated a cease-fire.
"I saw bodies lying on the streets, around ruined buildings, in cars," said Lyudmila Ostayeva, 50, who had fled with her family to Dzhava, a village near the border with Russia. "It's impossible to count them now. There is hardly a single building left undamaged."
The fighting broke out as much of the world's attention was focused on the start of the Olympic Games and many leaders, including Russia's Prime Minister Vladimir Putin and President Bush, were in Beijing.
The timing suggested Georgian President Mikhail Saakashvili may have been counting on surprise to fulfill his longtime pledge to wrest back control of South Ossetia — a key to his hold on power. The rebels seek to unite with North Ossetia, which is part of Russia.
Saakashvili agreed the timing was not coincidental, but accused Russia of being the aggressor. "Most decision makers have gone for the holidays," he told CNN. "Brilliant moment to attack a small country."
Seeking to prevent an all-out war, diplomats issued a flurry of statements calling on both sides to halt the fighting. The U.N. Security Council held two tense emergency sessions 12 hours apart with both sides using the forum to launch accusations. As the meeting recessed, officials promised a third council session Saturday.
Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice urged Russia to halt aircraft and missile attacks and withdraw combat forces from Georgian territory. Rice said in a statement the United States wants Russia to respect Georgian sovereignty and agree to international mediation.
The leader of South Ossetia's rebel government, Eduard Kokoity, said about 1,400 people were killed in the onslaught, the Interfax news agency reported. The toll could not be independently confirmed.
As night fell, there were conflicting claims as to who held the battlefield advantage.
Saakashvili said "Georgian military forces completely control all the territory of South Ossetia" except for a northern section adjacent to Russia. But Russian news agencies cited a Russian military official as saying heavy fighting was under way on the outskirts of the regional capital.
It was unclear what might persuade either side to stop shooting. Both claim the battle started after the other side violated a cease-fire that had been declared just hours earlier after a week of sporadic clashes.
The United States was sending in its top Caucasus envoy, Deputy Assistant Secretary of State Matthew Bryza, to try to end the bloodshed.
It was the worst outbreak of hostilities since the province won de facto independence in a war against Georgia that ended in 1992. Russian troops went in as peacekeepers but Georgia alleges they now back the separatists.
Russia, which has granted citizenship to most of the region's residents, appeared to lay much of the responsibility for ending the fighting on Washington.
In a telephone conversation with Rice, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said Georgia must be convinced to withdraw its forces, according to a ministry statement.
Georgia, which borders the Black Sea between Turkey and Russia, was ruled by Moscow for most of the two centuries preceding the breakup of the Soviet Union. Georgia has angered Russia by seeking NATO membership — a bid Moscow regards as part of a Western effort to weaken its influence in the region.
Saakashvili long has pledged to restore Tbilisi's rule over South Ossetia and another breakaway province, Abkhazia. Both regions have run their own affairs without international recognition since splitting from Georgia in the early 1990s and have built up ties with Moscow.
Georgia has about 2,000 troops in Iraq, making it the third-largest contributor to coalition forces after the U.S. and Britain. But Saakashvili told CNN the troops would be called home Saturday in the face of the South Ossetia fighting.
A senior U.S. defense official said Georgian authorities have asked the United States for help getting their troops out of Iraq. The official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because the discussions have been private, said no formal decision has been made on whether to support the departure, but said it is likely the U.S. will do so.
Also, Pentagon officials said Adm. Mike Mullen, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, has reached out to his counterparts in Russia and Georgia, but has not yet connected with them.
Early Saturday, Interior Ministry spokesman Shota Utiashvili said the Vaziani military base on the outskirts of the Georgian capital was bombed by warplanes during the night and that bombs fell in the area of the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan oil pipeline. He also said two other Georgian military bases were hit and that warplanes bombed the Black Sea port city of Poti, which has a sizable oil shipment facility.
Utiashvili said there apparently were significant casualties and damage in the attacks, but that further details would not be known until the morning.
Earlier, Georgia's Foreign Ministry accused Russian aircraft of bombing two military air bases, inflicting some casualties and destroying several military aircraft. Rustavi 2 television said four people were killed and five wounded at the Marneuli air base.
Twelve Russian troops were killed and 30 wounded in the fighting, said Russian Ground Forces spokesman Col. Igor Konashenkov.
Russia's Defense Ministry said it was sending in reinforcements for its troops in the province, and Russian state television and Georgian officials reported a convoy of tanks had crossed the border. The convoy was expected to reach the provincial capital, Tskhinvali, by evening, Channel One television said.
"We are facing Russian aggression," said Georgia's Security Council chief Kakha Lomaya. "They have sent in their troops and weapons and they are bombing our towns."
Putin warned in the early stages of the conflict that the Georgian attack would draw retaliation and the Defense Ministry pledged to protect South Ossetians, most of whom have Russian citizenship.
Chairing a session of his Security Council in the Kremlin, Russian President Dmitry Medvedev also vowed that Moscow will protect Russian citizens.
"In accordance with the constitution and federal law, I, as president of Russia, am obliged to protect lives and dignity of Russian citizens wherever they are located," Medvedev said. "We won't allow the death of our compatriots go unpunished."
On Friday, an AP reporter saw tanks and other heavy weapons concentrating on the Russian side of the border with South Ossetia — supporting the reports of an incursion. Some villagers were fleeing into Russia.
The Georgian state minister for reintegration, Temur Yakobashvili, said Georgian forces had shot down four Russian combat planes over Georgian territory but gave no details. Russia's Defense Ministry denied an earlier Georgia report about one Russian plane downed and had no immediate comment on the latest claim.
Yakobashvili said one Russian plane had dropped a bomb on the Vaziani military base near the Georgian capital, but no one was hurt. More than 1,000 U.S. Marines and soldiers were at the base last month to teach combat skills to Georgian troops.
South Ossetia officials said Georgia attacked with aircraft, armor and heavy artillery. Georgian troops fired missiles at Tskhinvali, an official said, and many buildings were on fire.
Georgia's president said Russian aircraft bombed several Georgian villages and other civilian facilities.
A senior Russian diplomat in charge of the South Ossetian conflict, Yuri Popov, dismissed the Georgian claims of Russian bombings as misinformation, the RIA-Novosti news agency reported.
The Georgian attack came just hours after Saakashvili announced a unilateral cease-fire in a television broadcast late Thursday in which he also urged South Ossetian separatist leaders to enter talks on resolving the conflict.
Georgian officials later blamed South Ossetian separatists for thwarting the cease-fire by shelling Georgian villages in the area. |
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mr_headshot
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Joined: Oct 10, 2006
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Location: ur base
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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| The thing with me is, I'm convinced and have been for several years, that Russia is going to begin trying to take the former bloc countries back. The Kiev fiasco with the election a couple years ago, and the long since forgotten display of a "new russian military power" parade have only feuled this. Now with the ever increasing closeness in proximity to the states, and this whole Georgia thing, it seems too real. |
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evutch
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Joined: Sep 24, 2006
Posts: 2741
Location: the lions den, reptiles lair, and satans playground-DC
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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we have NO business messing with former soviet block countries by getting them into NATO.
it's pissing in the russian faces..
not smart.
not smart at all. |
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Neal51
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Joined: Jul 06, 2007
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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More Stupid white people, duh
Ethnic cleansing of dumbasses...................YEAH  |
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screamzero
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Joined: Feb 08, 2008
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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| ..if they chill 'em down....spit...friggin' Ruskies gettin' uppity...this is some real pretty shi-i-i-yatt... |
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Neal51
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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| screamzero wrote: |
| ..if they chill 'em down....spit...friggin' Ruskies gettin' uppity...this is some real pretty shi-i-i-yatt... |
Scream0
I recommend Hennessy(vsop)/Macanudo Ascots
get a grip |
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screamzero
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Joined: Feb 08, 2008
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Neal51 wrote: |
| screamzero wrote: |
| ..if they chill 'em down....spit...friggin' Ruskies gettin' uppity...this is some real pretty shi-i-i-yatt... |
Scream0
I recommend Hennessy(vsop)/Macanudo Ascots
get a grip |
...one whale testicle...crushed. On ice. ...smackers and huggies...  |
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Saturos
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Joined: Feb 19, 2003
Posts: 1319
Location: Dark Universe
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 7:13 pm Post subject: |
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After all Putin did say at one time that he wants to rebuild the Sovjetunion...  |
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The truth is hidden so well, it´s right infront of you... |
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nefariousenator
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Joined: Jul 09, 2006
Posts: 62
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:01 pm Post subject: |
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| evutch wrote: |
we have NO business messing with former soviet block countries by getting them into NATO.
it's pissing in the russian faces..
not smart.
not smart at all. |
We don't? Georgia is the third biggest contributor of troops in Iraq, after ourselves and England. They have been our ally since we offered them protection in return for their cooperation on the ground. They gave us what we asked of them, and now we should return the favour and honour our promises.
We should immediately fly out their troops from Iraq straight to wherever they want to go. We should do it in our own aircraft, and warn Russia that should theyt attack a single one of those aircraft, we'll nuke 'em back to the stone age!
Now let's get that draft started and open a whole new can of whoop-ass! Semper Fidelis. |
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icewhale
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Posts: 1083
Location: Deepest Darkest Dorset
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| Posted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:15 pm Post subject: |
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| greeney2 wrote: |
I think you are going to see the difference between Russian bombers, and the United States Stealth bombers and lazer/gps guided bombs, judging from the death toll and the fact they shot down 2 bombers.
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You want the US to get militarily involved with this?
icewhale |
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_________________
Although I respect your right to this material, I would request that you are circumspect in your use and dissemination of this material, which in certain circumstances could be of use to potential terrorists or used to aid proliferation. |
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greeney2
B.V. Info-a-holic
Joined: Sep 28, 2001
Posts: 9857
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 1:44 am Post subject: |
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Not at all icewhale!
My point is that we have been spending the last few years here talking about innocent death tolls in Afganistan and Iraq. Smart bombs pinpoint specific targets and ultimately save collateral damage lives. I think you are about to see Russia doesn;t have these kind of capabilities, and already the collateral death toll of huge. If they don't stop and negotiate this, you will see stagering numbers. |
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