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MrGray
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Joined: Aug 12, 2007
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Location: Ca, USA
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 Posted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 11:18 am Post subject: Opportunity Mars rover finds timber? |
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Mr_TopSecret00X
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| Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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| I am really supprised that NASA released these photos. |
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martiandrifter01
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Joined: Mar 28, 2008
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Location: Xanthe Terra, Sol IV/Mars
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| Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 4:02 pm Post subject: |
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Timber, my scaly red discharge port. It's laying in a rover tire track. Image doctoring? Not necessary, all the 'rover' cameras have dust on their lenses. The shiny round thing fell of the rover that took the picture, and we're not going to put it back on for you. You'll have to fly here and fix it yourselves.  |
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greywolfe1960
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Joined: May 06, 2008
Posts: 4
Location: S. Indiana, USA
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| Posted: Wed May 07, 2008 12:21 pm Post subject: Re: Opportunity Mars rover finds timber? |
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| MrGray wrote: |
| http://www.marsanomalyresearch.com/evidence-reports/2004/072/opportunity-mixed.htm |
I'm not so sure about the "timber", though it is intriguing, but the doctored images are obvious. NASA complains about budget cuts, but then they spend our money jerking around with the images we paid for. It seems that should the truth be known, there would be a greater public outcry for manned exploration. It's almost like they are trying to cut their own throats and that makes NO sense. |
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martiandrifter01
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Joined: Mar 28, 2008
Posts: 784
Location: Xanthe Terra, Sol IV/Mars
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| Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 9:36 am Post subject: |
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Now, the really fun part, unless you get the images from NASA instead of second-hand, is finding out how much was doctored by whom. If you have any questions about a published image purportedly taken by NASA check with their site.
A lot of images are of varying quality from one part to another: don't forget that Mars is currently well over sixty million miles away and the images are transmitted back to Earth in layers or segments, and reassembled at our end. Interference such as solar radiation can play havoc with digital and analog signals alike. |
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willo
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Location: Inez, KY
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| Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 8:26 am Post subject: |
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I admit it does look an awful lot like timber, but without having a good quality image to examine, I wouldn't make that call.
You also have to consider that the human mind looks for patterns and objects in photos like that and will usually find them in some way or another. They're probably just rocks.
As for the images being doctored, I don't know about that either. Seems like an awful lot of trouble for NASA to go through why not just straight up not release the photos?
Besides, they're NASA, I could do a better job doctoring those photos so I'm sure they could since they have much better equipment than I do. |
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rhw007
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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First I am surprised,saddened and a little 'torqued' that Mr skipper did NOT post a link, or tell us WHICH sol he got that right image from in this image about the wood:
http://www.marsanomalyresearch.com/evidence-reports/2004/072/1-072-clouds-timber.jpg
He said look at May 24 and indeed in the "Press Release" image it says these images were taken around sol 115...I searched from 100-130 and could not find the feature.
Mr. Skipper is usually good about posting direct links to the jpeg itself, or at least tell us which SOL the image came from...in this case he did neither.
I was going to make a RGB if there had been enough RGB data acquired but alas I am through searching I have other things to do and there are just many other interesting things on Mars than an old wooden beam.
Bob... |
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willo
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 10:35 pm Post subject: |
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| now that's interesting rhw - hard to verify w/o original raw data |
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rhw007
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 10:47 am Post subject: |
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| willo wrote: |
| now that's interesting rhw - hard to verify w/o original raw data |
Yes and if I had found the original jpegs I could have downloaded the non-jpeg data from the PDS that aren't jpeged with artifacts and also done some of my own processing on the actual RAW data...which btw..are NOT the jpegs....the jpgs are "representations" of the raw PDS data.
But without the Sol #, jpeg # he used to used on his right part of the image I linked to which does NOT look like a crop from the full mosiac...there's not much more I can do to verify or repeat his work independantly with the REAL RAW data set for the MER rovers in the PDS.
too bad...as I said he is USUALLY good about such things. Makes me wonder why he left it out.
Bob... |
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willo
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| Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 6:20 am Post subject: |
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| right.. I'd like to get a copy of the original RAW data to process as well.. Any time you have data compression you're going to get artifacts, which IMO is what is mostly responsible for all of the "you can see where NASA edited this image here" claims you see.. If you have any luck locating the original files, let me know. |
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Questioner101
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| Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:39 am Post subject: |
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When they dig up Dr. Who's Pyramid of Mars "mummy" skull....it's going to get peculiar.  |
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rhw007
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Joined: Oct 03, 2001
Posts: 52
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 11:39 am Post subject: |
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| willo wrote: |
| right.. I'd like to get a copy of the original RAW data to process as well.. Any time you have data compression you're going to get artifacts, which IMO is what is mostly responsible for all of the "you can see where NASA edited this image here" claims you see.. If you have any luck locating the original files, let me know. |
Actually after searching from sols 100-130 I emailed Mr. Skipper and he provided me with a link which he since UPDATED the above link to include that link to the NAVCAM images it came from.
http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/1/n/115/1N138388241EFF2700P1994R0M1.HTML
the above one is probably the best view. I have sent copies of correspondence with the PDS about this and why there were no PanCam images acquired. I verified this by using this site here and selecting only pancam and navcam for sol 115 of rover opportnity:
http://an.rsl.wustl.edu/mer/merb/merb.htm
The above link is VERY IMPORTANT LINK...If interested in access to ALL the raw and processed rover data including data to make 3D meshes to import into 3D programs like Bryce, Lightwave, Truespace or others...that data can be found there...brought to you by a side link the PDS person gave me which led me to this one.
I have searched sol 115 for both pancam and nav images for sol 115 and can report that yes the rover ran over it...looked back at it with the REAR navigation camera...and IF a PanCam was done...it is NOT in the PDS system whose control of that is the Prinicple Investigators of the MERS.
I would suggest those interested email the PIs with the link to the above NavCam image and ask why this "Anomalous Rock" was NOT imaged using the PanCam for color and specific mineral properties.
Post answers in this thread.
Bob...
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willo
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Joined: Dec 29, 2002
Posts: 203
Location: Inez, KY
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 1:07 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm thinking perhaps we should put our heads together on this one 007, do some processing, perhaps create a 3d mesh or 2, and try and get some answers. I'm of the opinion it's not really a timber and it's just a rock, but I would still like to KNOW that and not just figure on it. |
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willo
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Joined: Dec 29, 2002
Posts: 203
Location: Inez, KY
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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007, might wanna check this link out also, lets you view different images from the rovers based on sites, dates, different cameras, etc. I guess it's really no different than the other sites, except the interface is prettier 
http://www.marsquestonline.org/mer/mer_viewer.php?location=meridiani&imageType=edr&id=15493&path=200405
Oh, and in case you didn't already know, this is how to decode the image filenames in order to figure out what site it was taken, by what rover, what camera, etc. |
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rhw007
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Joined: Oct 03, 2001
Posts: 52
Location: USA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2008 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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| willo wrote: |
| I'm thinking perhaps we should put our heads together on this one 007, do some processing, perhaps create a 3d mesh or 2, and try and get some answers. I'm of the opinion it's not really a timber and it's just a rock, but I would still like to KNOW that and not just figure on it. |
Such things are available ONLY from the PanCam images...which of course either they took them and sequestered them....or did NOT taken them which is a blatant travesty of "Science" to NOT have done a THOROUGH spetrum acquisition with the PanCam suite of filters so that not only color but minerological...and 3D meshes...could be generated.
As to the other links yes I am aware of that one.
However the main point here is to ASK why the rover scientists did NOT do the PanCam...or if they did...were TOLD to squelch or hide the data under Sec 1206.300 sub (b) para (1) or para (9) of NASA "Law" that specifically states that data dealing with "National Security Issues" may be classified, airbrushed, withheld or even destroyed.
Why would a "Petrified Log" on Mars be of a "National Security Issue"?
Bob... |
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